Little Mermaid Communication: TALK Framework with Chalise

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So I help people make good financial decisions,

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typically when the stakes are high and emotions

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are high and when communication matters. Many

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times communication breaking down is one of the

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things that really leads to a lot of other problems.

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When communication breaks down, then people start

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looking for the validation somewhere else. She

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knew what dad expected. He had very high expectations.

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He wasn't willing to have a conversation, wasn't

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willing to talk about it. What he says goes.

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What 16 -year -old likes that? He needs to connect

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with her in a way that's not my way or the highway.

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And by asking questions to open up that dialogue

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so that she feels like it's a safe place to communicate.

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If I'm thinking while you're talking about the

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next thing that I'm going to say, am I really

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being present? I think people, when you're having

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a conversation, they're not always going to remember

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the words that we're using, but they will remember

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how they felt. Welcome to Yes And Land, where

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we say yes to the reality of yesterday and today.

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And we say and to the possibility, growth, and

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imagination of tomorrow. All right, welcome to

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Yes and Land. We are very excited for our guest

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today and very excited for the topic today, which

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I think is very on point for society today, for

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where life is at, for where people are at. And

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that topic today is really about communication.

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And our guest today is Shalise, wonderful individual

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who I've known for a number of years. Very excited

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to have her on, breaking down some things for

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us today, helping us understand how to be better

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communicators. She and her profession has to

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be an expert communicator, frankly. as a certified

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financial planner, certified divorce financial

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analyst. I think you have some other acronyms

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there. I don't know them all, but they're all

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really great. And they're all very wonderful

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and require a high degree of ability to communicate

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effectively, I believe. So it's gonna be fun

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to talk about that today. And we're gonna do

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it through the lens of the Little Mermaid. Yes.

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Which is gonna be fun. Yep. Which is gonna be

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fun. So, Chalice, let's start out here. What

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I always like to do is kind of give our audience

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a little bit of background just to kind of know

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a little bit more about you, kind of sets the

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stage for kind of where you ended up in your

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career and then also sets the stage for the topic

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of communication. So give us this little breakdown

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of like, where did you come from? Who is Shalice?

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Wow, that's a loaded question. I mean, yeah,

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you mentioned it. I'm a CFP. I work in divorce.

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I'm a financial planner. So I help people make

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good financial decisions, typically when the

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stakes are high and emotions are high and when

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communication matters. So it helps. I use it.

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I use communication daily. The better communicator

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we are, that we can convey what's important to

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clients, usually it ends better. So let's take

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it even further back, though. That's career stuff.

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Tell us about, like, where are you from originally?

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Once upon a time, I was born in Sandy, Utah.

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Sandy, Utah. So not far from here. Just a stone's

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throw from where we're at in South Jordan. Love

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it. I grew up in Draper. I went to Alta High

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School. I went to the University of Utah. And

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you, growing up, we just talked about this in

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the pre -show, you have two siblings, but not

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biological siblings. Nope. Technically, they

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are adopted. Tell me more about that. What was

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that like? It was awesome. Yeah, my mom and dad,

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my mom couldn't have kids after me. And so they

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tried and tried and they did all the things.

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Back then, IVF was not as successful as it is

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now. So it didn't work and they struggled. And

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so adoption just was the method we needed to

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complete our family. Yeah. It was great. And

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your parents ended up adopting two. Two, yeah.

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My sister and my brother. And when your parents

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adopted your sister, how old were you? 11. Okay.

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And then your brother? 15, I think. So you were

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a tween and then a teenager. Yeah. But you handled

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it like a champ because you said like it was

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wonderful. I mean, I was a little older, 11 years

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between me and my sister. So it was fun. It was

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great. So you didn't experience, because sometimes

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what biological children will experience when

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suddenly there's this new. person in the mix

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especially when it comes through something like

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an adoption there's a bit of jealousy or there's

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difficulty because a lot of attention is paid

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to that new child but that was not a thing for

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you No, no. My parents were really good about

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not forcing me to babysit. You know, I still

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got to play with my friends and I could babysit

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when I wanted. It was no, it was lovely. My sister

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was born on my birthday party. So my birthday

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was October is October 10th and hers was the

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11th. So it was always fun growing up. Yeah.

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Parties. Good. So you then, I think you said

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you went to the University of Utah? Mm -hmm.

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What did you study? Economics. Economics. Okay.

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Let's go. What year did you graduate? I don't

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know that end of this. I don't remember. So I

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graduated in 99 from high school. So five years

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later. Okay. Yeah. So 2004. Yeah. Okay. So I

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went to University of Utah as well. I was a finance

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major. Okay. I did take some economics classes,

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though, and they were fabulous. But I started

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in 2000, but then went on a two -year mission,

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and so I didn't finish up until 2006. So I finished

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up a couple years after you did. So we were there

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at the same time. We did fly a crossover there.

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We might have had a class together. It is possible.

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It certainly is possible. I seriously considered

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doing. economics because the classes, I think

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the professor I had was just so good. I was like,

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man, maybe I really like this stuff. But I knew

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I was going to go to law school. I was like,

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well, the finance is a pretty easy path. And

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I took some real estate classes as part of the

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finance degree too. And I was like, ah, it seems

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pretty easy. I'll just do that before law school.

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And so I kind of ran that direction, which worked

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out fine. So you finish up your undergrad. Yeah.

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And then immediately into financial planning?

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Yeah. My, yep. I was, I worked, there was a Morgan

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Stanley, a Discover card shift when I was in

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college. It was a four hour, four days a week

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shift. It was perfect. So I started, that was

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the first time in business that I was, the light

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went off and was like, hmm. That was the first

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time I started asking my dad questions, too,

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because my dad was the financial planner. I had

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no idea before that what he did. And that was

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what started to spark like, Dad, what do you

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do? So it kind of explained it. And so I worked

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at Morgan Stanley through college. When I graduated,

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I interned here and there with him. And then

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when I graduated, I started working with his

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firm. Amazing. So if you were to. Put to words

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what it is that you love about financial planning.

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Why you still continue to do it through your

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career. What would that be? What's your why for

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doing financial planning? Well, number one, I

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love Tetris. I love numbers. I love putting things

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where they go. So I loved that growing up. And

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that's financial planning. There's a method to

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it. There's strategy. But it's figuring out what

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pieces go where for a family. So I love that

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component. I love math. I love numbers. I love

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that two plus two always equals four. It gives

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me the happiest, warm, fuzzy feeling. I love

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it. And that's financial planning. When I can

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figure it out and make sense to me and hopefully

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make sense to a family and my clients, that's

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why. I love it. I love being that person that

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they come to for questions and help them through

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challenges and all the new things, having babies,

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going to school, retirement. All that stuff is

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so rewarding. And then a few years ago, I found

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divorce. And that's taken on a whole other avenue

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that's challenging. But also, you know, when

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you're helping someone go through such a hard

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time. across the bridge to where it's transitional

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into a whole new life, it's pretty rewarding.

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For sure. Yeah. So on that topic, you know that

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I'm divorced, right? I got divorced a number

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of years ago and remarried and got a couple of

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kids and you're divorced as well, right? So,

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you know, I think it's an interesting question

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on this topic before we dive into the major components

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of this topic, of the acronym for TALK. When

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it comes to communication, what role did that

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play in your divorce? Either communication or

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the deterioration of the communication? Or did

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it? Was that not really a thing for you guys?

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I mean, I don't recall having struggles communicating

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in my marriage. We were pretty good communicating.

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I mean, of course you fight, you know, and you've

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got to figure out how to have conflict resolution.

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No, I think we did it pretty well. How about

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you? Yeah, I mean, communication deteriorated

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over time where, you know, we weren't fully communicating

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to each other. We didn't fight a lot, but we

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weren't in an effective communication relationship

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to really like get to the deeper levels of communication.

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Yeah. To get aligned, to stay aligned, to make

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sure we were tracking in the right direction.

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to make sure that we could resolve things that

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came up. And so the communication became very

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ineffective over time. I mean, if somebody's

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surface level is looking at it, probably like,

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oh, you guys communicate just fine. And it wasn't.

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It wasn't at all. And that's something that I

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see a lot in divorce, which is I think many times

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communication breaking down is one of the things

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that really leads to a lot of other problems.

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When communication breaks down, then people start

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looking for the validation somewhere else. When

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communication breaks down, then suddenly they

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stop sharing with each other about finances.

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And now finances becomes a big problem and they

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won't talk about it. Or communication breaks

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down, so then they don't like being with the

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in -laws, right, or whatever. And so they don't

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talk about it or they have ineffective communication

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when it comes to those things. And so a lot of

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times I see it circling back to, man, there was

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red flags. That if they could have resolved it

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earlier on with the communication component,

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it might have avoided a lot of the other things

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that came later on and kind of trace it back

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to that communication. It's an art. It is. I

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mean, the art of communication for sure. And

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the better you are at all aspects of life improve.

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Yeah. Do you feel like you and your ex are pretty

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good communicators when it comes to co -parenting?

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Yeah. That's huge. What role has that played

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in? making it easier for your son. Yeah. I mean,

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oh, it's huge. I mean, I know some people can't

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even have their parents in the same room. They

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struggle with going to, you know, soccer games

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or we don't have any of that. So it's nice. There's

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no anxiety there. Hopefully, hopefully he feels

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that way, but yeah. And, and yeah, that. ability

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to co -parent effectively when it comes to those

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things has such a positive impact on the children.

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Yeah. Plus, kids are smart, right? So they go

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to dad's house, they get away with something,

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go to mom's house, get away with something. No,

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we're talking about it. We're going to know.

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And it's hard because even when a couple is living

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together, kids play against each other. Like

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100 % they do, right? Oh, yeah, for sure. I can

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only imagine that Ariel, if her mom had been

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around, she probably would have been playing

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her mom and her dad against each other a little

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bit, right? That probably would have been her

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thing. She definitely didn't have effective communication

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with King Triton, right? No. The communication

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there right at the gate was like struggle bus,

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right? She knew what dad expected. He had very

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high expectations. He wasn't willing to have

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a conversation, wasn't willing to talk about

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it. Where she had her head... What he says goes.

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Yes. Yeah. What 16 -year -old likes that? Yeah,

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nah, nobody, right? I mean, maybe there are some

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people pleasers, right? That might not play out

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well over the long run. I think my 13 -year -old's

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probably a little bit that way. He's a little

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bit of a people pleaser. And so he wants to try

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to do, you know, what I ask or his mom asks or

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my wife or his stepdad because he's such a people

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pleaser. But it's something that I've talked

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with them about like over time, like we can't

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just be people pleasers all the time because

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then people take advantage of you and it can

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have really negative effects in the long run

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in your career. But for the most part, 16 -year

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-olds don't want to have ruling with an iron

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fist from their parents. No, no. Well, at least

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in my house, they don't. I agree with you with

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the people pleasing thing, though. I mean, I

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worry about. I worry about. drugs out there,

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how everything that just the fentanyl situation

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that's happening right now and you never know

00:14:12.009 --> 00:14:16.250
and and getting tricked into something or peer

00:14:16.250 --> 00:14:19.649
pressure, things like that. So we're always having

00:14:19.649 --> 00:14:22.450
those conversations of I need to be able to feel

00:14:22.450 --> 00:14:24.710
confident that when you're in an uncomfortable

00:14:24.710 --> 00:14:27.870
situation, you know how to get yourself out of

00:14:27.870 --> 00:14:32.710
it without succumbing to peer pressure. So. Yeah,

00:14:32.809 --> 00:14:34.909
we do try to have those conversations, too, because

00:14:34.909 --> 00:14:37.110
it's a scary world out there. Yeah, no doubt

00:14:37.110 --> 00:14:38.389
about it. You've got to be prepared to stand

00:14:38.389 --> 00:14:41.230
up for yourself and have that inner confidence

00:14:41.230 --> 00:14:45.230
to do that. Yeah, for sure. So when it comes

00:14:45.230 --> 00:14:48.029
to these kind of effective communication tools

00:14:48.029 --> 00:14:50.669
that we have, we've got kind of one of the topics

00:14:50.669 --> 00:14:53.750
today, which is Alison Woodbrooks, who is a Harvard

00:14:53.750 --> 00:14:57.629
professor, studied communication for the better

00:14:57.629 --> 00:15:00.490
part of 20 years, two decades. And it's one of

00:15:00.490 --> 00:15:03.129
the foremost experts in communication. Like she

00:15:03.129 --> 00:15:06.889
is like expert, right? And wrote a book called

00:15:06.889 --> 00:15:08.429
Talk. And that was what we're going to a little

00:15:08.429 --> 00:15:09.529
bit about what we're going to talk about today.

00:15:09.669 --> 00:15:11.649
So do you want to set the stage for us? Like

00:15:11.649 --> 00:15:14.570
tell everybody what this acronym TALK stands

00:15:14.570 --> 00:15:18.470
for. Yeah. So, well, and when I grew up, I want

00:15:18.470 --> 00:15:21.870
to take her class someday. That sounds like such

00:15:21.870 --> 00:15:28.200
a fun class. So TALK, it's. The structure starts

00:15:28.200 --> 00:15:31.379
with T, which is topics. So should we just go

00:15:31.379 --> 00:15:34.039
into it? Okay. Yeah. Yeah. T is for topics. So

00:15:34.039 --> 00:15:36.259
she sort of describes that, you know, when you're

00:15:36.259 --> 00:15:38.139
going on a date for the first time, you usually

00:15:38.139 --> 00:15:41.600
prepare for, you know, you're doing your outfit

00:15:41.600 --> 00:15:44.519
or your hair and you're thinking about where

00:15:44.519 --> 00:15:46.379
you're going to go to dinner. But nobody really

00:15:46.379 --> 00:15:49.139
thinks about what they're going to talk about.

00:15:49.320 --> 00:15:52.740
And so just setting the stage in your mind for

00:15:52.740 --> 00:15:55.039
even 30 seconds about a couple of things you

00:15:55.039 --> 00:15:59.549
can bring. to that conversation prior to helps

00:15:59.549 --> 00:16:03.389
the conversation go better. And it reduces anxiety.

00:16:03.649 --> 00:16:05.750
It makes everybody just a little more relaxed,

00:16:05.929 --> 00:16:09.769
which helps the date go better, right? So topics,

00:16:10.009 --> 00:16:13.389
it's preparing and having things in your back

00:16:13.389 --> 00:16:18.149
pocket that you can discuss. A is the next one.

00:16:18.230 --> 00:16:20.210
So this is probably the most important part.

00:16:20.350 --> 00:16:24.389
It's asking questions, asking follow -up questions

00:16:24.389 --> 00:16:28.490
and being, interested and curious and engaged.

00:16:28.730 --> 00:16:32.950
And that is just the sparkler of the whole structure.

00:16:33.029 --> 00:16:38.450
So asking better questions. We have L, which

00:16:38.450 --> 00:16:42.870
sounds for levity. So, so far we've got topics

00:16:42.870 --> 00:16:45.690
asking. So far we've got an interrogation, right?

00:16:45.789 --> 00:16:48.809
Levity is so that we're lighting things up, right?

00:16:48.970 --> 00:16:54.389
We want to bring warmth. We want to bring humor.

00:16:54.629 --> 00:16:58.090
Sometimes it's, you know, jabbing at yourself,

00:16:58.269 --> 00:17:00.789
not being so serious, just bringing a lightness

00:17:00.789 --> 00:17:03.850
so that you're engaging and making people feel

00:17:03.850 --> 00:17:10.609
comfortable. And then K is kindness. And, you

00:17:10.609 --> 00:17:14.960
know, that's that's so. So that you can stay

00:17:14.960 --> 00:17:19.079
in the conversation. Kindness takes work. It's

00:17:19.079 --> 00:17:26.420
acknowledging before disagreeing. It's just bringing

00:17:26.420 --> 00:17:32.079
a level of warmth to the conversation. Is that

00:17:32.079 --> 00:17:34.420
how you took it? Yes, absolutely. What would

00:17:34.420 --> 00:17:37.859
you say about kindness? Yeah, I think, well.

00:17:38.589 --> 00:17:41.630
What I think about kindness, I think, goes well

00:17:41.630 --> 00:17:44.309
with one of the quotes that I had on that topic.

00:17:44.910 --> 00:17:48.769
Oh, what I wanted to say, too, is kindness, people

00:17:48.769 --> 00:17:52.930
will stay in conversations when they feel respected,

00:17:53.049 --> 00:17:56.410
and that's kind of kindness. So when you're having

00:17:56.410 --> 00:17:58.930
hard conversations, which we do in work all the

00:17:58.930 --> 00:18:02.450
time, adding that kindness component allows people

00:18:02.450 --> 00:18:06.140
the safety to stay in with you. Yeah, for sure.

00:18:06.440 --> 00:18:10.039
What are your questions? So I was actually not

00:18:10.039 --> 00:18:14.160
the one I was thinking of. So, well, it is. So

00:18:14.160 --> 00:18:16.859
Vanessa Van Edwards. I love her. She said, the

00:18:16.859 --> 00:18:18.880
power of our first impression lies not in what

00:18:18.880 --> 00:18:21.680
we say, but how we say it. And so I think a lot

00:18:21.680 --> 00:18:24.180
of this kindness is it's a delivery mechanism.

00:18:25.099 --> 00:18:27.460
You know, we could have something really great

00:18:27.460 --> 00:18:31.180
to contribute. But if we say it really harshly.

00:18:31.609 --> 00:18:33.890
or we say it in a rude way or a condescending

00:18:33.890 --> 00:18:36.450
way or in a disparaging way it's just not going

00:18:36.450 --> 00:18:38.529
to be well received and the idea of talk is like

00:18:38.529 --> 00:18:41.250
how are we going to have good quality conversations

00:18:41.250 --> 00:18:43.710
how are we going to keep the conversation going

00:18:43.710 --> 00:18:47.769
and when we can bring that kindness to it when

00:18:47.769 --> 00:18:51.089
the way we say things does matter it will help

00:18:51.089 --> 00:18:54.009
to keep it going if we want to keep the conversation

00:18:54.009 --> 00:18:55.869
going and when we keep the conversation going

00:18:55.869 --> 00:18:57.750
it makes for better relationships that's kind

00:18:57.750 --> 00:18:59.630
of the idea that's the way i took it right along

00:19:01.099 --> 00:19:08.460
I love it. Yeah. So Alison Brooks, Alison Brooke

00:19:08.460 --> 00:19:14.940
Woods, is that it? Wood Brooks. Okay. Yeah, she's

00:19:14.940 --> 00:19:18.380
the words. She's using the verbal communication

00:19:18.380 --> 00:19:22.440
where Vanessa Van Edwards is using cues and body

00:19:22.440 --> 00:19:27.240
language and tone. And so I agree with you. She's

00:19:27.240 --> 00:19:29.220
fascinating and everything she's bringing to

00:19:29.220 --> 00:19:33.240
the communication table is, I love it. But yeah,

00:19:33.319 --> 00:19:36.039
it is how you're delivering it. And if your words

00:19:36.039 --> 00:19:38.640
and your body language don't match, the person

00:19:38.640 --> 00:19:41.640
you're talking to won't buy it. Yeah. Yeah, that's

00:19:41.640 --> 00:19:44.640
right. And it's important to pay attention to

00:19:44.640 --> 00:19:48.099
both. Yeah. Okay. So let's do a little bit of

00:19:48.099 --> 00:19:50.420
a deeper dive into each one of these. Does that

00:19:50.420 --> 00:19:53.000
work for you? Sure. Okay. So I've got other quotes

00:19:53.000 --> 00:19:54.200
to read. I'm going to get your take on each one

00:19:54.200 --> 00:19:56.940
of these, okay? Okay. So the first one is about

00:19:56.940 --> 00:20:00.839
tea, right? Topics. And it's what Allison said.

00:20:00.900 --> 00:20:03.259
She said, at every moment of every conversation,

00:20:03.519 --> 00:20:06.140
everyone involved is making little micro choices

00:20:06.140 --> 00:20:09.240
that help to steer topics. Every time you speak,

00:20:09.359 --> 00:20:11.819
you sort of have your hand on the steering wheel

00:20:11.819 --> 00:20:15.539
of the topical flow. And you're choosing, should

00:20:15.539 --> 00:20:18.000
we stay on this current topic? Should we drift

00:20:18.000 --> 00:20:21.299
gently in another direction? Let me get your

00:20:21.299 --> 00:20:25.799
take on that. Yeah, I mean, I think in any moment

00:20:25.799 --> 00:20:28.279
when you're going back and forth with someone,

00:20:28.359 --> 00:20:32.579
you have an opportunity to dive deeper or jump

00:20:32.579 --> 00:20:38.259
ship to another topic. Sometimes staying on the

00:20:38.259 --> 00:20:40.779
first topic and diving deeper, though, that's

00:20:40.779 --> 00:20:43.599
when you get to the good stuff. And I do think

00:20:43.599 --> 00:20:47.450
she talks about that, you know, asking. staying

00:20:47.450 --> 00:20:52.089
on a topic, asking follow -up questions to sort

00:20:52.089 --> 00:20:56.190
of dive deeper to get a little bit more magic

00:20:56.190 --> 00:20:59.390
out of something before jumping ship onto the

00:20:59.390 --> 00:21:02.009
next thing. Yeah. One of the things I like that

00:21:02.009 --> 00:21:05.089
she says here, a specific word is gently. Should

00:21:05.089 --> 00:21:07.710
we drift gently in another direction? Because

00:21:07.710 --> 00:21:10.170
we've all been in those conversations where you're

00:21:10.170 --> 00:21:12.009
on a particular topic and someone's involved

00:21:12.009 --> 00:21:16.849
in it and suddenly it is a complete 180. And

00:21:16.849 --> 00:21:18.690
they have something entirely different that's

00:21:18.690 --> 00:21:20.430
not connected in any way that's super abrupt

00:21:20.430 --> 00:21:22.710
and they want to talk about it. And that can

00:21:22.710 --> 00:21:25.670
be really off -putting, right? Right. Well, you

00:21:25.670 --> 00:21:28.490
feel like you weren't heard in the first place

00:21:28.490 --> 00:21:31.349
and that what you were saying didn't matter.

00:21:31.630 --> 00:21:36.990
Yeah. That's true, too. And it's so hard when

00:21:36.990 --> 00:21:40.950
we're going back and forth. If I'm thinking while

00:21:40.950 --> 00:21:42.990
you're talking about the next thing that I'm

00:21:42.990 --> 00:21:48.039
going to say. Am I really being present? That's

00:21:48.039 --> 00:21:50.420
always something we're working on. Yeah. And

00:21:50.420 --> 00:21:52.619
the answer is usually no. No. And even if you

00:21:52.619 --> 00:21:54.839
think you are or you're trying to listen, if

00:21:54.839 --> 00:21:56.940
you have that abruptness, you're going to make

00:21:56.940 --> 00:21:58.480
the other person feel like you weren't listening

00:21:58.480 --> 00:22:00.500
at all. And I think that's the way it comes across.

00:22:00.640 --> 00:22:02.019
That's why I like this idea of it being gently.

00:22:02.160 --> 00:22:04.339
Let me ask you another kind of take on this thing

00:22:04.339 --> 00:22:06.880
of topics. She talks about this a little bit

00:22:06.880 --> 00:22:10.279
as well, which is small talk, especially when

00:22:10.279 --> 00:22:13.259
you're meeting somebody for the first time. What's

00:22:13.259 --> 00:22:16.319
your take on small talk? I guess let's just start

00:22:16.319 --> 00:22:17.460
out there. What's your take on small talk? I

00:22:17.460 --> 00:22:21.339
think small talk is you have to have small talk

00:22:21.339 --> 00:22:24.059
in order to get to the deep stuff. You've got

00:22:24.059 --> 00:22:27.680
to start there. So nobody really loves it, I

00:22:27.680 --> 00:22:33.500
don't think. But you have to start there that

00:22:33.500 --> 00:22:38.140
earns the good stuff. Yeah. And one of the points

00:22:38.140 --> 00:22:40.759
that she made in an interview that she did was,

00:22:41.530 --> 00:22:44.490
You have to have it, but people stay on it too

00:22:44.490 --> 00:22:47.509
long. So you got to have some small talk, but

00:22:47.509 --> 00:22:50.809
she suggested like even just like a single question,

00:22:50.930 --> 00:22:52.789
right? Because when people always like complain

00:22:52.789 --> 00:22:54.269
about like, oh, you got to ask about what the

00:22:54.269 --> 00:22:56.730
weather is and oh, I hate this small talk. She's

00:22:56.730 --> 00:22:58.930
like, ask what the weather is and then move to

00:22:58.930 --> 00:23:00.230
the next thing. Just don't stay on the small

00:23:00.230 --> 00:23:02.529
talk, right? Ask about it to kind of break the

00:23:02.529 --> 00:23:05.329
ice and then move. And I think one of the key

00:23:05.329 --> 00:23:08.539
things. that you just have to learn in a conversation

00:23:08.539 --> 00:23:11.140
learn over time is when's the appropriate time

00:23:11.140 --> 00:23:14.519
to make those advances uh topically and then

00:23:14.519 --> 00:23:17.140
getting deeper because you have to you can't

00:23:17.140 --> 00:23:18.839
come up meet somebody for the first time and

00:23:18.839 --> 00:23:22.599
say like what's the purpose of life for you like

00:23:22.599 --> 00:23:25.500
what what what are we talking about yeah who

00:23:25.500 --> 00:23:28.039
are you i have no idea where you're from what

00:23:28.039 --> 00:23:29.920
are you even talking about right you can't get

00:23:29.920 --> 00:23:33.700
there too fast either yeah so small talk like

00:23:33.700 --> 00:23:36.460
small but they're still like There's in -between

00:23:36.460 --> 00:23:38.960
topical conversations you've got to, like, go

00:23:38.960 --> 00:23:41.779
down the pathway of before you can get to a lot

00:23:41.779 --> 00:23:46.599
deeper conversation. So true. And I don't hate

00:23:46.599 --> 00:23:49.859
small talk, to be honest. And maybe it's because

00:23:49.859 --> 00:23:51.720
I just know that it's an avenue to get somewhere

00:23:51.720 --> 00:23:56.480
else. Yeah. I know. I've been trying to make

00:23:56.480 --> 00:23:59.930
it a little more interesting. There you go. What

00:23:59.930 --> 00:24:02.430
have you done? Well, I'm working. I'm working

00:24:02.430 --> 00:24:04.930
on it. I'm a constant learner. Okay. So like

00:24:04.930 --> 00:24:07.769
everybody says, it's so natural to just say,

00:24:07.930 --> 00:24:12.190
how's it going? Or how's your day? Or, you know,

00:24:12.210 --> 00:24:15.430
the weather or something. So trying to change

00:24:15.430 --> 00:24:19.650
up those words so that the answer isn't the mundane

00:24:19.650 --> 00:24:22.470
answer we've all been doing. It's just ingrained.

00:24:22.529 --> 00:24:26.309
It's a habit. We all do it. All of us. We have

00:24:26.309 --> 00:24:29.230
to break it. And by doing it, just... Just trying

00:24:29.230 --> 00:24:32.190
to be a little different. So, you know, what's

00:24:32.190 --> 00:24:34.609
exciting about your week? What's a goal you're

00:24:34.609 --> 00:24:39.130
working on this week? You know, just little different

00:24:39.130 --> 00:24:41.470
questions. It's still small talk. It's still

00:24:41.470 --> 00:24:43.930
not offensive. I'm not interrogating you. I'm

00:24:43.930 --> 00:24:45.930
still asking the same question without it being

00:24:45.930 --> 00:24:49.230
the same words. Yeah. I had somebody ask me a

00:24:49.230 --> 00:24:52.509
question very early on in a conversation I was

00:24:52.509 --> 00:24:55.069
having with them that I really loved. And they

00:24:55.069 --> 00:24:56.650
asked, like, what's the most exciting thing you're

00:24:56.650 --> 00:24:59.549
working on right now? Yeah, see? And I was like,

00:24:59.809 --> 00:25:02.589
okay, all right. Well, yeah, here's some exciting

00:25:02.589 --> 00:25:06.130
things. Yeah, like, let's go. And it didn't take

00:25:06.130 --> 00:25:08.450
hardly any small talk before that question. I

00:25:08.450 --> 00:25:10.029
was willing to answer because of the way that

00:25:10.029 --> 00:25:12.329
it was phrased. And it was interesting, right?

00:25:12.450 --> 00:25:15.349
Like, it's a positive way. It's an upbeat thing

00:25:15.349 --> 00:25:17.109
because like, hey, what's exciting that you're

00:25:17.109 --> 00:25:18.930
working on? So it's also taking this positive

00:25:18.930 --> 00:25:20.970
spin, which was really good. I was like, man,

00:25:21.029 --> 00:25:22.670
I need to steal that. I need to borrow that question.

00:25:22.829 --> 00:25:25.690
Yeah. It was a good one. Vanessa Van Edwards

00:25:25.690 --> 00:25:30.750
is actually really good at trying to change this

00:25:30.750 --> 00:25:34.049
narrative with some of these small talk pieces.

00:25:35.789 --> 00:25:40.170
And what wisdom does she have for us? Just things

00:25:40.170 --> 00:25:43.210
like that. Asking things in a different way.

00:25:43.869 --> 00:25:47.410
Or don't say when someone asks you, how are you?

00:25:47.410 --> 00:25:50.650
You'll say, fine, busy. How many times have we

00:25:50.650 --> 00:25:53.799
all said that? Say something real. Say something

00:25:53.799 --> 00:25:57.660
like, you know, 9 out of 10 or something different.

00:25:57.799 --> 00:25:59.359
Yeah, like stuff like that. 9 out of 10. Yeah.

00:25:59.440 --> 00:26:01.539
Right? Because like, oh, okay. Because then it's

00:26:01.539 --> 00:26:03.940
almost, it brings in one of the other ones, which

00:26:03.940 --> 00:26:05.819
it's a little bit of levity too. Yeah, levity.

00:26:05.839 --> 00:26:08.660
You're like, well, analytically, I am a 9 out

00:26:08.660 --> 00:26:10.500
of 10 and let me tell you why. No, no. It's like,

00:26:10.500 --> 00:26:11.980
oh, 9 out of 10. Right? Yeah. It's kind of like

00:26:11.980 --> 00:26:16.819
fun and laughing. Or she'll say, better on the

00:26:16.819 --> 00:26:19.700
inside than the outside. Or, you know, if she's.

00:26:19.869 --> 00:26:22.670
you know, not done up or something. It's just

00:26:22.670 --> 00:26:25.289
making fun, making light of herself, not taking

00:26:25.289 --> 00:26:27.650
herself too seriously. But those things are cute.

00:26:27.769 --> 00:26:31.089
They're nuanced. They're different. And I think

00:26:31.089 --> 00:26:35.309
people like it. Yeah. Yeah, I think so. Because,

00:26:35.309 --> 00:26:37.289
you know, when we're bringing the first question,

00:26:37.349 --> 00:26:39.069
right, we can ask a different question other

00:26:39.069 --> 00:26:40.329
than the simple, like, how's the weather? How

00:26:40.329 --> 00:26:42.450
are you? But we know we're going to get that

00:26:42.450 --> 00:26:43.930
if somebody else is leading the conversation.

00:26:44.799 --> 00:26:47.119
And so if we do, yeah, being prepared with some,

00:26:47.119 --> 00:26:49.079
you know, some levity there, some nine out of

00:26:49.079 --> 00:26:51.420
tens or better on the inside than the outside.

00:26:51.500 --> 00:26:53.799
Yeah. That's kind of a fun one. Yeah, they're

00:26:53.799 --> 00:26:57.019
cute. Yeah. Okay. So here's another quote for

00:26:57.019 --> 00:27:00.039
you. Well, two. Okay. First off, there's a Little

00:27:00.039 --> 00:27:03.579
Mermaid quote on topic, on the topic of topic,

00:27:03.799 --> 00:27:09.500
I guess, as the case is here. She says, if only

00:27:09.500 --> 00:27:12.019
I could make him understand, speaking of her

00:27:12.019 --> 00:27:14.480
father. I just don't see things the way he does.

00:27:14.599 --> 00:27:16.779
I just don't see how a world that makes such

00:27:16.779 --> 00:27:22.619
wonderful things could be bad. And so what is

00:27:22.619 --> 00:27:26.039
she experiencing here when it comes to communication

00:27:26.039 --> 00:27:30.279
or the lack thereof, both from topics and then

00:27:30.279 --> 00:27:33.680
leading into the next one, which is asking questions?

00:27:42.480 --> 00:27:46.400
I'm trying to think of how it topics. She's she's

00:27:46.400 --> 00:27:50.059
so curious and she just wants to be free to experience

00:27:50.059 --> 00:27:56.059
the world through her lens. And her dad is terrified

00:27:56.059 --> 00:28:03.859
for her. Right. So. I don't know about topics.

00:28:03.940 --> 00:28:07.680
Asking for sure. He needs to ask her some questions.

00:28:07.720 --> 00:28:11.099
He needs to connect with her in a way that's

00:28:11.099 --> 00:28:16.480
not my way or the highway, you know, do it or

00:28:16.480 --> 00:28:22.819
else. Yeah. And by asking questions to open up

00:28:22.819 --> 00:28:25.319
that dialogue so that she feels like it's a safe

00:28:25.319 --> 00:28:28.680
place to communicate, I think would. be helpful

00:28:28.680 --> 00:28:31.099
for sure and because this is a parent -child

00:28:31.099 --> 00:28:34.460
relationship more of the uh onerous falls on

00:28:34.460 --> 00:28:37.099
on dad for sure if this wasn't if this was more

00:28:37.099 --> 00:28:40.759
of a two adults um having a conversation or having

00:28:40.759 --> 00:28:42.539
this situation happen to me it's a little bit

00:28:42.539 --> 00:28:47.519
of if if ariel is thinking about these things

00:28:47.519 --> 00:28:50.400
like oh i don't understand this i don't understand

00:28:50.400 --> 00:28:52.519
why he feels this way i don't understand how

00:28:52.519 --> 00:28:55.099
he doesn't see these things okay I can go into

00:28:55.099 --> 00:28:56.660
a conversation with him thinking about those

00:28:56.660 --> 00:28:58.660
topics in advance. Okay, I need to understand

00:28:58.660 --> 00:29:01.579
how he feels this way. And then I also need to

00:29:01.579 --> 00:29:04.680
be able to express how I feel about these topics.

00:29:04.859 --> 00:29:07.559
And so going in prepared with topics can help

00:29:07.559 --> 00:29:09.180
lead that conversation in the right direction.

00:29:09.279 --> 00:29:11.980
And then it leads naturally into that asking

00:29:11.980 --> 00:29:14.480
questions. Certainly, her dad would need to ask

00:29:14.480 --> 00:29:17.119
questions, but she can as well, right? She could

00:29:17.119 --> 00:29:20.599
help. to steer in that direction if she was truly

00:29:20.599 --> 00:29:23.319
curious to to get those answers from him like

00:29:23.319 --> 00:29:26.579
understand why he's so afraid of the surface

00:29:26.579 --> 00:29:29.400
why he's so afraid of humans i don't think at

00:29:29.400 --> 00:29:31.359
this point she really understands or has any

00:29:31.359 --> 00:29:33.480
idea why he would be obviously he's carrying

00:29:33.480 --> 00:29:36.220
something right he's carrying something as to

00:29:36.220 --> 00:29:38.579
why yeah why humans are dangerous there's something

00:29:38.579 --> 00:29:42.480
there for him as to why they are and she could

00:29:42.480 --> 00:29:45.259
try to understand it better by going and prepare

00:29:45.259 --> 00:29:47.400
with topics asking really good questions in that

00:29:47.400 --> 00:29:50.420
conversation right um here's another quote this

00:29:50.420 --> 00:29:53.980
is from renee brown she says i define connection

00:29:53.980 --> 00:29:57.039
as the energy that exists between people when

00:29:57.039 --> 00:30:00.420
they feel seen heard and valued when they can

00:30:00.420 --> 00:30:02.980
give and receive without judgment and when they

00:30:02.980 --> 00:30:06.700
derive sustenance and strength from the relationship

00:30:06.700 --> 00:30:12.140
okay so To me, I mean, this isn't necessarily

00:30:12.140 --> 00:30:14.759
tied to topics, but what does that mean for you

00:30:14.759 --> 00:30:18.980
as far as this topic goes of communication? When

00:30:18.980 --> 00:30:21.480
we're saying and acknowledging like connection

00:30:21.480 --> 00:30:24.900
is so important, right? We have got to have connection

00:30:24.900 --> 00:30:26.619
with other people. It's just like part of who

00:30:26.619 --> 00:30:29.259
we are. I think we're humans. That's what we're

00:30:29.259 --> 00:30:33.079
here for is to make connections with others.

00:30:33.339 --> 00:30:37.539
Yeah. And when we have effective. conversations

00:30:37.539 --> 00:30:40.019
when we can effectively communicate that it it

00:30:40.019 --> 00:30:43.460
creates this right she's saying it exists between

00:30:43.460 --> 00:30:46.819
people when they feel seen heard and valued and

00:30:46.819 --> 00:30:49.079
so i think this framework what it really can

00:30:49.079 --> 00:30:52.519
do is help us to help other people feel that

00:30:52.519 --> 00:30:55.880
way that conversation with us Agreed. I think

00:30:55.880 --> 00:30:59.039
people, when you're having a conversation, they're

00:30:59.039 --> 00:31:01.240
not always going to remember the words that we're

00:31:01.240 --> 00:31:03.619
using, but they will remember how they felt.

00:31:03.980 --> 00:31:08.000
That's what we're leaving with them. Yeah. So

00:31:08.000 --> 00:31:10.200
I agree. And I think it leads perfectly into

00:31:10.200 --> 00:31:13.160
the asking questions, right? And when it comes

00:31:13.160 --> 00:31:15.200
to asking questions, what does it mean to you

00:31:15.200 --> 00:31:17.579
to like ask better questions? Because we can

00:31:17.579 --> 00:31:19.400
ask a variety of questions. It doesn't mean they're

00:31:19.400 --> 00:31:25.059
like good questions. I think you just start and

00:31:25.059 --> 00:31:28.359
then you follow up and then you keep going. And

00:31:28.359 --> 00:31:33.440
if you're going into it genuinely curious and

00:31:33.440 --> 00:31:36.420
wanting to know, that's when the magic happens.

00:31:37.140 --> 00:31:39.859
How do you do that when you're not necessarily

00:31:39.859 --> 00:31:43.099
genuinely curious? Well, you have to be. You

00:31:43.099 --> 00:31:45.579
have to. Or don't do it. I mean, you have to

00:31:45.579 --> 00:31:48.119
be authentic. You gotta dig deep. Yeah. I mean,

00:31:48.140 --> 00:31:49.980
it has to come from a place of authenticity.

00:31:50.240 --> 00:31:53.000
Otherwise, yes, you are going to look like a

00:31:53.000 --> 00:31:56.099
fraud. Yeah. Yeah. But don't you think as humans,

00:31:56.160 --> 00:32:00.099
all of us have a curiosity component? Yes. And

00:32:00.099 --> 00:32:02.619
if we felt comfortable enough to slow down and

00:32:02.619 --> 00:32:05.579
really follow up with questions, we would, I

00:32:05.579 --> 00:32:09.240
think. Yeah. And I think this is part goes back

00:32:09.240 --> 00:32:12.079
to the preparation going into it. If we know

00:32:12.079 --> 00:32:17.079
that like, okay, I'm interested in. understanding

00:32:17.079 --> 00:32:19.380
better this person's perspective where they're

00:32:19.380 --> 00:32:22.700
coming from now we've reframed it for our brains

00:32:22.700 --> 00:32:25.539
so we go in the conversation and we ask the follow

00:32:25.539 --> 00:32:27.980
-up questions we frame that way i'm going in

00:32:27.980 --> 00:32:29.759
knowing i need to ask more questions because

00:32:29.759 --> 00:32:32.779
okay i actually do want to understand because

00:32:32.779 --> 00:32:34.579
there's this this dichotomy that exists within

00:32:34.579 --> 00:32:38.789
us right we all have like the egocentric part

00:32:38.789 --> 00:32:41.069
of ourselves that just want to talk about ourselves

00:32:41.069 --> 00:32:44.329
and be about ourselves. Self -focus all the time.

00:32:44.430 --> 00:32:47.170
Right? And we have to fight against that a little

00:32:47.170 --> 00:32:49.569
bit to do this effectively. And so the framing

00:32:49.569 --> 00:32:51.809
at the beginning can help us do that more effectively

00:32:51.809 --> 00:32:54.569
when we're entering in so we can be genuine.

00:32:55.029 --> 00:32:58.609
Sometimes it's hard. When you were talking, I

00:32:58.609 --> 00:33:01.089
was just hearing Kristen Wiig and Saturday Night

00:33:01.089 --> 00:33:04.509
Live going, oh, you did that? I did it too. I

00:33:04.509 --> 00:33:07.150
did it first. Oh, you have that? I have one.

00:33:07.549 --> 00:33:10.849
A classic one -upper. Yeah. The sketches she

00:33:10.849 --> 00:33:13.890
did on that were so hilarious. I love her. And

00:33:13.890 --> 00:33:15.990
the thing is, they're extreme examples, but we

00:33:15.990 --> 00:33:18.650
also all know people who love to be the one -upper.

00:33:18.829 --> 00:33:21.450
Sure. No matter what comes up, it's like they've

00:33:21.450 --> 00:33:24.589
got to talk about themselves. And that's where

00:33:24.589 --> 00:33:28.670
I think there's also a pretty bright line, this

00:33:28.670 --> 00:33:31.230
distinction between those asking genuine questions

00:33:31.230 --> 00:33:33.809
because they want to know, they're curious, and

00:33:33.809 --> 00:33:35.369
those that are asking a question just so they

00:33:35.369 --> 00:33:38.160
can bring it back to themselves. That's true.

00:33:38.279 --> 00:33:40.079
Sometimes people ask questions, but it's really

00:33:40.079 --> 00:33:41.960
just so they can talk about what they want to

00:33:41.960 --> 00:33:44.099
talk about. They're steering the conversation.

00:33:44.619 --> 00:33:46.240
And then they can share their story that they're

00:33:46.240 --> 00:33:48.259
really excited to share. Because again, we all

00:33:48.259 --> 00:33:50.140
have a little bit of that like egocentric nature

00:33:50.140 --> 00:33:53.819
to us. And there's a tendency to do that. And

00:33:53.819 --> 00:33:56.279
we've all seen it, right? Somebody asks a question

00:33:56.279 --> 00:34:00.400
because, hey, you know what? Do you like concerts?

00:34:00.819 --> 00:34:02.619
Right? And you're like, oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. This

00:34:02.619 --> 00:34:04.779
concert I just went to. Yeah. They want to tell

00:34:04.779 --> 00:34:06.059
about the concert they went to instead of like,

00:34:06.140 --> 00:34:07.839
oh, you love concerts. Oh, why do you why do

00:34:07.839 --> 00:34:10.219
you love concerts? OK, like have you gone to

00:34:10.219 --> 00:34:11.619
them your whole life? Like, what is that? What

00:34:11.619 --> 00:34:13.679
does that mean? Like, yeah. What kind of concerts

00:34:13.679 --> 00:34:14.960
do you go to? What's your favorite kind of music?

00:34:16.179 --> 00:34:20.440
And so that that idea of steering just to go

00:34:20.440 --> 00:34:22.900
back to yourself or genuinely, sincerely want

00:34:22.900 --> 00:34:24.280
to know what the other person says, I think it's

00:34:24.280 --> 00:34:27.360
a pretty key distinction there when it comes

00:34:27.360 --> 00:34:30.599
to asking questions. OK, so here's here's another

00:34:30.599 --> 00:34:34.239
quote from Allison. She says, you can ask follow

00:34:34.239 --> 00:34:37.400
-up questions, the superhero of questions. You

00:34:37.400 --> 00:34:39.320
can repeat and affirm what you've heard your

00:34:39.320 --> 00:34:41.900
partner say. You can use back -channel utterances

00:34:41.900 --> 00:34:45.599
like, yeah, mm -hmm, and fascinating to cheer

00:34:45.599 --> 00:34:49.340
on your partner as they tell a story. What's

00:34:49.340 --> 00:34:51.219
the importance of that if somebody else is telling

00:34:51.219 --> 00:35:00.980
a story to, like, stay engaged? Well, it tells

00:35:00.980 --> 00:35:08.559
them that you're listening. First of all, I'm

00:35:08.559 --> 00:35:10.719
thinking back to she was just on a podcast with

00:35:10.719 --> 00:35:12.739
Mel Robbins. And they were talking about this.

00:35:12.820 --> 00:35:15.880
And Mel Robbins was giving an example when she

00:35:15.880 --> 00:35:20.000
was communicating with her husband. Her husband

00:35:20.000 --> 00:35:24.119
was telling her something. And she had her back

00:35:24.119 --> 00:35:26.559
turned to him. And he said, are you listening

00:35:26.559 --> 00:35:31.150
to me? repeated back what he had said, but in

00:35:31.150 --> 00:35:34.809
a snarky way, right? And he said, I'm not asking

00:35:34.809 --> 00:35:37.489
if you are listening to me. I'm asking for your

00:35:37.489 --> 00:35:41.030
hearing me. Like, are you here with me talking?

00:35:41.570 --> 00:35:46.130
You know, that was the point is that no, she

00:35:46.130 --> 00:35:47.829
wasn't because her back was turned. He didn't

00:35:47.829 --> 00:35:50.849
feel like she was engaged in the conversation.

00:35:51.690 --> 00:35:55.489
She was showing that she didn't care. So showing

00:35:55.489 --> 00:35:59.929
your partner that you're listening by reaffirming

00:35:59.929 --> 00:36:03.349
what they're saying or, or adding in chiming

00:36:03.349 --> 00:36:06.690
in. I think it just tells your person that you're

00:36:06.690 --> 00:36:11.469
there with them and you care. Yeah. Before we

00:36:11.469 --> 00:36:14.730
jump back in, can I ask you a quick favor? If

00:36:14.730 --> 00:36:17.050
you're enjoying the journey so far, will you

00:36:17.050 --> 00:36:20.530
like rate and subscribe to our show? It helps

00:36:20.530 --> 00:36:23.610
us reach more people like you. We can design

00:36:23.610 --> 00:36:26.130
and create and build the most wonderful place

00:36:26.130 --> 00:36:29.019
in the world. But it takes people to make the

00:36:29.019 --> 00:36:33.099
dream a reality. Again, it goes back to that

00:36:33.099 --> 00:36:35.340
we all need to feel seen, heard, and valued.

00:36:35.860 --> 00:36:38.820
Yeah, how do you want that other person to feel

00:36:38.820 --> 00:36:43.219
when talking to you? And if we want to feel closer,

00:36:43.300 --> 00:36:45.219
if we want to feel like we've got a good, solid

00:36:45.219 --> 00:36:47.340
relationship, we both have to feel that way.

00:36:47.699 --> 00:36:50.199
And these things are really key to bringing that

00:36:50.199 --> 00:36:53.360
out. My son does that all the time. Uh -huh,

00:36:53.400 --> 00:36:58.900
uh -huh. Right? Yeah, totally. Like you can just

00:36:58.900 --> 00:37:04.500
see the glaze go over. Yeah, sure. I'm one that

00:37:04.500 --> 00:37:07.659
I have a one -track mind. I don't multitask well.

00:37:08.260 --> 00:37:11.420
And so like in Mel Robbins' example, if my back

00:37:11.420 --> 00:37:13.559
was turned and my wife's saying something, oh,

00:37:13.599 --> 00:37:16.000
I'm not hearing anything. Like I always tell

00:37:16.000 --> 00:37:18.980
her like, honey, I apologize. You got to have

00:37:18.980 --> 00:37:21.840
my eye contact. So like let me know that you

00:37:21.840 --> 00:37:24.480
need to like talk and like you got my eye contact

00:37:24.480 --> 00:37:26.809
and I'm listening. Because if I'm not, if I'm

00:37:26.809 --> 00:37:28.670
like kind of watching the TV or doing something

00:37:28.670 --> 00:37:31.489
else, it's like, I got nothing. I got nothing.

00:37:31.510 --> 00:37:33.130
And then she's not going to feel, you know, heard

00:37:33.130 --> 00:37:34.989
or seen, of course, because I'm not hearing her

00:37:34.989 --> 00:37:37.750
or seeing her in those moments. Yeah. I mean,

00:37:37.789 --> 00:37:39.869
I think, yeah, I think that's when the magic

00:37:39.869 --> 00:37:42.550
happens for couples, especially where you can

00:37:42.550 --> 00:37:45.230
really show up for your partner. How does it,

00:37:45.250 --> 00:37:48.150
how does this, how do you see this play out in

00:37:48.150 --> 00:37:52.570
your professional practice? When you're... sitting

00:37:52.570 --> 00:37:54.590
down and visiting with someone who's stressed

00:37:54.590 --> 00:37:57.710
about retirement and are they going to be able

00:37:57.710 --> 00:37:59.789
to get themselves in the place they need to be

00:37:59.789 --> 00:38:02.730
or they're going through a divorce and they're

00:38:02.730 --> 00:38:05.010
stressed about, you know, how this divorce is

00:38:05.010 --> 00:38:07.329
shaking up their financial future. How do you

00:38:07.329 --> 00:38:10.090
see this showing up and what's the importance

00:38:10.090 --> 00:38:12.070
of that for you to be able to be there for your

00:38:12.070 --> 00:38:18.380
clients? Oh, I think acknowledging is step one.

00:38:18.559 --> 00:38:20.639
You know, it's okay that you're feeling this

00:38:20.639 --> 00:38:22.340
way. It makes sense that you're feeling this

00:38:22.340 --> 00:38:24.619
way. And we're going to take the time to walk

00:38:24.619 --> 00:38:27.179
through it. Here's step one, right? You just

00:38:27.179 --> 00:38:29.380
have to meet them where they are. Everybody's

00:38:29.380 --> 00:38:32.000
different. Everybody processes different, especially

00:38:32.000 --> 00:38:38.280
in divorce. Yeah, you just have to acknowledge

00:38:38.280 --> 00:38:41.360
where they are. Tell them it's okay. I got you.

00:38:41.400 --> 00:38:44.559
I'm here. We'll get through it together. You're

00:38:44.559 --> 00:38:47.739
not alone. Yeah. And that makes a huge difference.

00:38:48.480 --> 00:38:51.119
If you ask good follow -up questions, are able

00:38:51.119 --> 00:38:52.940
to really explain the things that are there,

00:38:53.059 --> 00:38:56.079
and they have those reassurances, it makes a

00:38:56.079 --> 00:39:00.059
huge difference. I've found in doing divorces

00:39:00.059 --> 00:39:04.179
that some attorneys just don't ask the questions

00:39:04.179 --> 00:39:06.380
they need to ask. Really? Because the clients,

00:39:06.420 --> 00:39:08.480
especially in initial consultation, the clients

00:39:08.480 --> 00:39:09.579
don't know everything they're supposed to tell

00:39:09.579 --> 00:39:12.900
you. They might want to barf up a lot of information.

00:39:13.900 --> 00:39:15.480
They don't necessarily know the things that are

00:39:15.480 --> 00:39:19.360
like important or, you know, what's pertinent

00:39:19.360 --> 00:39:22.280
to how their case could play out. And so asking

00:39:22.280 --> 00:39:24.280
really great questions and then following up

00:39:24.280 --> 00:39:26.800
with those questions to a client, especially

00:39:26.800 --> 00:39:31.079
when they're new, can help in understanding their

00:39:31.079 --> 00:39:33.739
motivations, their goals, understanding if there

00:39:33.739 --> 00:39:35.280
are certain things in their case that you need

00:39:35.280 --> 00:39:36.980
to be aware of because there are certain problems

00:39:36.980 --> 00:39:39.579
in their case. Yeah. And if you don't ask those

00:39:39.579 --> 00:39:42.079
questions and bother to ask and just assume that,

00:39:42.119 --> 00:39:44.469
you know. Now, suddenly you can't give as good

00:39:44.469 --> 00:39:47.050
a representation because you haven't asked really

00:39:47.050 --> 00:39:50.449
great follow up questions. So I think those are

00:39:50.449 --> 00:39:56.030
totally key. OK, so the answer can be no. But

00:39:56.030 --> 00:39:58.590
in our podcast prep meeting, we talked a little

00:39:58.590 --> 00:40:01.750
bit about maybe doing a role play where you were

00:40:01.750 --> 00:40:04.789
going to like. Show us, model this for us in

00:40:04.789 --> 00:40:07.309
asking questions. Okay. So what's the setting?

00:40:07.409 --> 00:40:11.210
Set the setting for us. Who am I and who are

00:40:11.210 --> 00:40:12.510
you? And you're going to ask me a bunch of questions.

00:40:14.550 --> 00:40:18.469
Well, why don't you be you and I'll be me and

00:40:18.469 --> 00:40:20.409
I'll ask you some questions. You've never met

00:40:20.409 --> 00:40:23.909
me before or know each other. We're just friends.

00:40:24.150 --> 00:40:26.929
Okay. Okay. I'm here for it. I'm ready. Okay.

00:40:27.110 --> 00:40:31.030
Okay. Ryan, what did you have for breakfast today?

00:40:31.880 --> 00:40:36.659
I had a protein shake and a Rockstar, which I

00:40:36.659 --> 00:40:39.980
have most mornings. Wow, Rockstar, really? So,

00:40:40.099 --> 00:40:43.380
okay, what's in your protein shake? It's just

00:40:43.380 --> 00:40:46.500
protein powder and skim milk. That's it? That

00:40:46.500 --> 00:40:48.659
is literally it. What flavor of protein powder?

00:40:48.760 --> 00:40:51.380
Definitely chocolate. Chocolate and skim milk.

00:40:51.500 --> 00:40:54.840
Yes. Is that, to you, your favorite breakfast?

00:40:56.469 --> 00:40:59.309
No, it's just fast and easy. So it's usually

00:40:59.309 --> 00:41:02.329
what I do. I usually have premier protein, but

00:41:02.329 --> 00:41:05.010
today it was the powder. Okay. So when you're

00:41:05.010 --> 00:41:07.090
going to have your favorite breakfast, what does

00:41:07.090 --> 00:41:11.050
that look like? That would be chunky cinnamon

00:41:11.050 --> 00:41:14.139
French toast from Neater's. With the caramel

00:41:14.139 --> 00:41:18.000
syrup and the whipped cream and then strawberries

00:41:18.000 --> 00:41:22.420
on top. Is that something you eat weekly or monthly?

00:41:22.579 --> 00:41:25.039
Special occasions. Special occasions. Because

00:41:25.039 --> 00:41:27.440
you're healthy? Because you're trying to be healthy?

00:41:27.679 --> 00:41:31.519
Yes. And I also have a bit of a gluten intolerance.

00:41:31.519 --> 00:41:33.900
And so I have to like take a gluten pill. And

00:41:33.900 --> 00:41:35.699
I'm not going to feel great afterwards. If I

00:41:35.699 --> 00:41:38.480
take the pill, I'll be okay. But like, I'll make

00:41:38.480 --> 00:41:40.599
the sacrifice every once in a while. Okay. When

00:41:40.599 --> 00:41:43.599
did you find that you had a gluten sensitivity?

00:41:44.820 --> 00:41:50.019
This was, it was about four years ago. Yeah.

00:41:50.619 --> 00:41:53.820
How did you find out? You just got sick or? My

00:41:53.820 --> 00:41:56.219
brother actually started to develop it about

00:41:56.219 --> 00:41:59.260
two years prior. And so I kind of seen him, see

00:41:59.260 --> 00:42:01.079
him kind of go through that process of like,

00:42:01.099 --> 00:42:02.860
it wasn't bad at first. And then he went to just

00:42:02.860 --> 00:42:06.320
wheat bread and wheat type products, whole wheat

00:42:06.320 --> 00:42:08.099
type products. And then he had to completely

00:42:08.099 --> 00:42:11.639
exclude it. So then when I was feeling like consistently

00:42:11.639 --> 00:42:15.500
sick, after I would eat, I started getting an

00:42:15.500 --> 00:42:17.800
idea of like, I wonder, I wonder if that's what

00:42:17.800 --> 00:42:19.519
I have. Like the light bulb went off. Yeah. And

00:42:19.519 --> 00:42:21.420
so then I would take it away and be like, uh,

00:42:21.659 --> 00:42:26.039
that's great. Yeah. You connected that dot. So

00:42:26.039 --> 00:42:28.800
that was amazing because you kept the conversation

00:42:28.800 --> 00:42:31.639
going. And I wasn't I wasn't interrogating. No,

00:42:31.699 --> 00:42:34.860
you were curious. I felt like I could talk. I

00:42:34.860 --> 00:42:37.360
felt like you were very, very much listening

00:42:37.360 --> 00:42:39.000
to the things that I was saying. And that's why

00:42:39.000 --> 00:42:41.139
the conversation kept going, because you continue

00:42:41.139 --> 00:42:43.860
to ask questions that were on topic and taking

00:42:43.860 --> 00:42:45.519
it down the path. And I could have taken it a

00:42:45.519 --> 00:42:47.760
few different ways, too. And so there's just.

00:42:47.860 --> 00:42:52.909
Yeah. It's this fun flow. It is. I like it. that's

00:42:52.909 --> 00:42:54.750
great so that i mean i think that models really

00:42:54.750 --> 00:42:58.150
well like you can still steer it to some degree

00:42:58.150 --> 00:43:01.789
like where the conversation's going uh because

00:43:01.789 --> 00:43:03.409
you could have yeah when we're talking about

00:43:03.409 --> 00:43:04.929
food you could have taken it somewhere else with

00:43:04.929 --> 00:43:07.429
food we could have talked about more about the

00:43:07.429 --> 00:43:09.349
special occasions that i eat those but you took

00:43:09.349 --> 00:43:11.590
it down like oh why every once in a while which

00:43:11.590 --> 00:43:13.809
was really interesting and you got curious as

00:43:13.809 --> 00:43:15.789
to why i wouldn't have it that often was it health

00:43:15.789 --> 00:43:17.510
or was it something else yeah so it's really

00:43:17.510 --> 00:43:21.420
good and i And you shared the gluten. Yeah. I

00:43:21.420 --> 00:43:24.139
mean, it's a little deeper. Yeah. We got a little

00:43:24.139 --> 00:43:26.619
deeper. It was a little deeper. See that? I didn't

00:43:26.619 --> 00:43:28.960
realize that. It was. Small talk to deep talk.

00:43:29.000 --> 00:43:31.800
It is. See, that was modeled very well. I like

00:43:31.800 --> 00:43:34.539
it. I like it. I mean, I learned that from Allison

00:43:34.539 --> 00:43:38.460
in her book because she does it in her class.

00:43:38.539 --> 00:43:41.610
She talks about it. That's called. Endless follow

00:43:41.610 --> 00:43:43.469
-up questions or something like that where they

00:43:43.469 --> 00:43:46.710
practice it in their class. Just keep going.

00:43:46.809 --> 00:43:50.050
Keep going. It's endless. You can keep going

00:43:50.050 --> 00:43:52.389
with it. Yeah. I mean, it works really great.

00:43:52.630 --> 00:43:54.550
And I could have been like, I like protein powder.

00:43:54.710 --> 00:43:56.349
And that would have ended that pretty quick,

00:43:56.449 --> 00:43:59.530
right? Boring. Boring. Yeah, no one wants that,

00:43:59.590 --> 00:44:02.550
right? Oh, come on. Let's get to the good stuff.

00:44:02.670 --> 00:44:04.050
Let's get to the good stuff. Let's go where it

00:44:04.050 --> 00:44:06.949
needs to go. I love it. Okay, so. I forgot we

00:44:06.949 --> 00:44:10.349
talked about that. Here's another quote. I'll

00:44:10.349 --> 00:44:11.650
get your take on. This is from Tony Robbins.

00:44:12.650 --> 00:44:16.750
Quality questions create a quality life. Successful

00:44:16.750 --> 00:44:19.489
people ask better questions and as a result,

00:44:19.510 --> 00:44:23.570
they get better answers. How have you seen that

00:44:23.570 --> 00:44:26.489
play out in your life? I mean, I agree. I think

00:44:26.489 --> 00:44:30.269
questions create connection. We just established

00:44:30.269 --> 00:44:34.630
that. And so in my business or even in life.

00:44:35.980 --> 00:44:39.659
The better questions I can ask my son, my partner,

00:44:39.900 --> 00:44:43.119
my clients, the better answers I get and the

00:44:43.119 --> 00:44:48.219
more I can connect with them. She talks about

00:44:48.219 --> 00:44:52.000
this a little bit with your kids. Like my son

00:44:52.000 --> 00:44:55.179
plays basketball and he's going to practice all

00:44:55.179 --> 00:44:57.760
the time. And as he's running out the door, you

00:44:57.760 --> 00:45:01.280
know, I can be like, did you remember your basketball

00:45:01.280 --> 00:45:03.699
and your snacks and your water? And, you know,

00:45:03.719 --> 00:45:06.829
you're barking at them, right? Or you can stop

00:45:06.829 --> 00:45:09.429
for a second and say, you know, what do you need?

00:45:09.489 --> 00:45:11.730
Can I help you with something? What's going well?

00:45:11.949 --> 00:45:14.510
You know, things like that. Asking better questions

00:45:14.510 --> 00:45:16.909
leads to a better relationship, leads to a better

00:45:16.909 --> 00:45:20.449
connection. I think you mentioned earlier on

00:45:20.449 --> 00:45:22.769
something that resonated with me, which is that

00:45:22.769 --> 00:45:25.130
sometimes with your kids, there's like, uh -huh,

00:45:25.130 --> 00:45:28.250
yeah, uh -huh, no. Where it's just these very

00:45:28.250 --> 00:45:30.690
short answers, right? So you're asking questions

00:45:30.690 --> 00:45:32.789
and you're getting just like not a lot back.

00:45:34.829 --> 00:45:38.369
break through that with your son when you're

00:45:38.369 --> 00:45:41.670
kind of getting these like short answers, not

00:45:41.670 --> 00:45:44.530
engaging, like how do you break through? A humor.

00:45:44.710 --> 00:45:47.550
I mean, we call it, we call it, we label it.

00:45:47.670 --> 00:45:52.570
Like I can see that we've hit a point where you're

00:45:52.570 --> 00:45:56.250
just, you're playing me, right? So we just, I

00:45:56.250 --> 00:45:58.269
call him on it and we laugh about it. And then

00:45:58.269 --> 00:46:00.949
we start over with asking questions. Like, tell

00:46:00.949 --> 00:46:03.070
me more about what's going on. How can I help

00:46:03.070 --> 00:46:07.300
you? Good. I like that. It goes in the next one,

00:46:07.340 --> 00:46:09.980
bringing levity. Yeah. You can bring a little

00:46:09.980 --> 00:46:12.079
bit of levity. It does make a difference. Whereas,

00:46:12.260 --> 00:46:15.559
you know, if a child's not giving any answers

00:46:15.559 --> 00:46:18.619
and then they get scolded for it, you know, oh,

00:46:18.619 --> 00:46:20.119
you're only giving me one word answer. It's like,

00:46:20.159 --> 00:46:23.840
oh, it's disrespectful. It's not going to likely

00:46:23.840 --> 00:46:26.599
get as far or as well or as effectively build

00:46:26.599 --> 00:46:28.139
a relationship. Whereas if you can bring a little

00:46:28.139 --> 00:46:31.699
levity, name it, call it, poke fun at it. I can

00:46:31.699 --> 00:46:33.179
see how that would be really effective. Yeah.

00:46:33.869 --> 00:46:37.829
I'm lucky too because a little smirk goes a long

00:46:37.829 --> 00:46:40.530
way with him. So he'll just laugh. We'll just

00:46:40.530 --> 00:46:43.510
laugh and you start over. You reload. You reload.

00:46:43.969 --> 00:46:46.170
Do you name it that too? Like, okay, let's just

00:46:46.170 --> 00:46:49.989
reload. Let's reload. This is not working. I

00:46:49.989 --> 00:46:52.289
need a little more from you, buddy. Yeah. Oh,

00:46:52.289 --> 00:46:55.110
yeah. Let's try that. Just label it and then

00:46:55.110 --> 00:46:58.369
move on. Yeah, way too often. Especially if I'm

00:46:58.369 --> 00:47:01.699
picking my boys up after school. And they're

00:47:01.699 --> 00:47:03.599
in the car. And I start, like, you know, want

00:47:03.599 --> 00:47:04.880
to kind of find out about their day, how things

00:47:04.880 --> 00:47:06.639
went. You start with a little small talk with

00:47:06.639 --> 00:47:08.159
them, right? Like, oh, how was school today?

00:47:08.340 --> 00:47:11.179
Right? Small talk. And then, yeah, so many times

00:47:11.179 --> 00:47:13.440
it's just like nothing. I'm getting absolutely

00:47:13.440 --> 00:47:16.539
nothing. Change your questions. Change the questions.

00:47:16.619 --> 00:47:18.760
What's your favorite part about English today?

00:47:19.099 --> 00:47:24.860
What's exciting going on in band now? I do like

00:47:24.860 --> 00:47:28.739
a question my wife often asks the kids, which

00:47:28.739 --> 00:47:31.679
is, What's the best part of your day? That's

00:47:31.679 --> 00:47:33.519
a good one. And usually they'll give something.

00:47:33.599 --> 00:47:35.059
Now, sometimes they won't because kids are kids

00:47:35.059 --> 00:47:36.340
and sometimes they're just going to do their

00:47:36.340 --> 00:47:38.719
thing. But many times it's like, oh, okay, what

00:47:38.719 --> 00:47:40.519
was the best part? Like, what's this positive

00:47:40.519 --> 00:47:42.800
thing? Recess. Yeah, yeah, recess. Gym. Totally.

00:47:42.980 --> 00:47:44.980
That's what it would have been for me. Rarely

00:47:44.980 --> 00:47:46.639
is for my daughters. It's always usually something

00:47:46.639 --> 00:47:48.440
else. It's not usually recess, which is interesting.

00:47:48.579 --> 00:47:51.000
That is interesting. But as a boy, oh, yeah,

00:47:51.019 --> 00:47:53.119
it was always going to be recess. Yeah, Knox's

00:47:53.119 --> 00:47:56.889
answer was always recess. Yeah. Friends. Friends.

00:47:57.090 --> 00:48:00.469
Yeah. Food. Food. We do get that one. We do get

00:48:00.469 --> 00:48:03.449
that one a lot. Especially from our kindergartner.

00:48:03.849 --> 00:48:06.889
Because what the food menu was at school, like,

00:48:06.929 --> 00:48:08.750
is a big deal for her. So if it was something

00:48:08.750 --> 00:48:10.530
good, she is very excited to tell you how good

00:48:10.530 --> 00:48:13.610
it was. Which is really cute. That is so cute.

00:48:13.869 --> 00:48:17.010
Yeah. And kindergarten is such a fun age where

00:48:17.010 --> 00:48:19.769
they are so curious and excited about everything.

00:48:20.010 --> 00:48:22.690
Yeah. They're lucky. I think, too, with kids,

00:48:22.789 --> 00:48:26.599
you know. it sometimes is a little bit hard to

00:48:26.599 --> 00:48:29.539
be genuinely curious when they're telling you

00:48:29.539 --> 00:48:33.659
about just on end about ridiculous things that

00:48:33.659 --> 00:48:36.440
happened to them that day that are to them mean

00:48:36.440 --> 00:48:38.340
the world and are like the most insignificant

00:48:38.340 --> 00:48:41.679
things but like when i've been able to reframe

00:48:41.679 --> 00:48:43.119
and say like this is actually really important

00:48:43.119 --> 00:48:47.320
to to them then i actually can have more of that

00:48:47.320 --> 00:48:50.039
genuine curiosity whereas i was like oh my goodness

00:48:50.039 --> 00:48:52.300
this is so lame what are they continuing to tell

00:48:52.300 --> 00:48:55.039
me about this for Then my questions are terrible

00:48:55.039 --> 00:48:57.980
and I don't create the connection. Right. So

00:48:57.980 --> 00:48:59.960
we all have that reset we have to have at times.

00:48:59.960 --> 00:49:04.579
Right. Yeah. And again, kindness allows you to

00:49:04.579 --> 00:49:07.320
stay in these hard conversations. If you feel

00:49:07.320 --> 00:49:09.599
respected and safe, you'll stay in. But if you

00:49:09.599 --> 00:49:12.639
don't, you'll check out. And that's definitely

00:49:12.639 --> 00:49:16.699
what we saw from Ariel and King Triton. Right.

00:49:17.039 --> 00:49:20.239
That their conversations were not at a place

00:49:20.239 --> 00:49:24.130
where either one of them. Was heard or seen.

00:49:24.329 --> 00:49:26.929
Right. Well, they hit a wall. Right. And so then

00:49:26.929 --> 00:49:29.590
she rebels and she goes off and to an extreme.

00:49:29.710 --> 00:49:33.050
Yeah. And then goes to Ursula. Ooh, our villain.

00:49:33.250 --> 00:49:35.369
Our villain. She's a great villain too, by the

00:49:35.369 --> 00:49:39.769
way. Oh, master manipulator. Totally. Talk about,

00:49:39.789 --> 00:49:46.190
yeah, using communication to her agenda. Yeah.

00:49:46.190 --> 00:49:50.090
Uh -huh. Yeah, she's— Avoiding fine print. Yeah,

00:49:50.210 --> 00:49:53.869
very manipulative. Yeah, and just all for selfish

00:49:53.869 --> 00:49:57.070
purposes. Yeah, for sure. Because part of me,

00:49:57.150 --> 00:49:58.670
when I hear it, I'm like, okay, she's having

00:49:58.670 --> 00:50:00.409
him sign a contract, and she's holding him to

00:50:00.409 --> 00:50:02.429
this contract. So part of me is like, from the

00:50:02.429 --> 00:50:04.070
legal perspective, like— This is a contract law.

00:50:04.250 --> 00:50:06.329
She agreed to it. I mean, it's a minor, so she

00:50:06.329 --> 00:50:07.949
couldn't technically agree, right? That's the

00:50:07.949 --> 00:50:10.190
technicality there. But let's assume she wasn't

00:50:10.190 --> 00:50:11.630
a minor. Like, yeah, it's a contract, right?

00:50:11.730 --> 00:50:14.699
Like, hey. You don't want this deal. Don't make

00:50:14.699 --> 00:50:17.639
the deal. It's not a very fair deal. Pretty stupid.

00:50:17.980 --> 00:50:21.460
But it is interesting that what she has taken

00:50:21.460 --> 00:50:25.440
away is her voice. It's also interesting. It

00:50:25.440 --> 00:50:28.079
is interesting. And yet this has to then, I guess,

00:50:28.099 --> 00:50:31.199
as Ursula says, right, like there's always body

00:50:31.199 --> 00:50:34.300
language, which I think is obviously an extreme

00:50:34.300 --> 00:50:37.699
example. But I think it highlights what you mentioned

00:50:37.699 --> 00:50:39.340
earlier, which is body language actually is really

00:50:39.340 --> 00:50:43.030
important. Yeah, and think about it when, okay,

00:50:43.110 --> 00:50:50.670
so Ariel uses body language. She can't talk anymore,

00:50:50.809 --> 00:50:53.230
and she's seeing this world for the first time.

00:50:53.690 --> 00:50:57.449
It's all new. She's got wide eyes. She's happy.

00:50:57.610 --> 00:50:59.730
She's excited. She's feeling all the things.

00:51:00.429 --> 00:51:04.590
She's so inviting. And then when Ursula comes

00:51:04.590 --> 00:51:09.920
back into the human form, And it's her body language

00:51:09.920 --> 00:51:13.940
is just yikes, right? Like you feel it so quickly.

00:51:14.039 --> 00:51:17.159
And I think that's what Vanessa Van Edwards talks

00:51:17.159 --> 00:51:19.460
about all the time, that you can make a first

00:51:19.460 --> 00:51:23.800
impression before any words are spoken. And your

00:51:23.800 --> 00:51:26.300
mind is made up whether or not you can trust

00:51:26.300 --> 00:51:31.139
that person from body language cues alone, how

00:51:31.139 --> 00:51:33.579
you're coming, how you're showing up to the world.

00:51:33.940 --> 00:51:36.800
Is it warm? Is it confident? Is it trustworthy?

00:51:37.530 --> 00:51:39.489
Because the other person is trying to decide

00:51:39.489 --> 00:51:42.230
that. Yeah. Yeah. Before any words are spoken.

00:51:42.510 --> 00:51:46.389
Yeah. We're all judging each other all the time.

00:51:46.510 --> 00:51:48.949
Mm -hmm. For good or for bad, we're all doing

00:51:48.949 --> 00:51:51.630
it. Yeah. And body language is first and more

00:51:51.630 --> 00:51:53.929
important. Yeah. And it will supersede the words.

00:51:54.269 --> 00:51:57.309
Sure. So. Again, for good or for bad. Mm -hmm.

00:51:57.329 --> 00:52:02.590
Yeah. Okay. So the next letter is L, which we've

00:52:02.590 --> 00:52:05.269
touched on, obviously. Mm -hmm. Here's the quote

00:52:05.269 --> 00:52:08.750
on this one from Allison. Levity is not trying

00:52:08.750 --> 00:52:12.289
to turn anyone into a comedian or a clown, which

00:52:12.289 --> 00:52:13.829
I love that she said that because, like, I'm

00:52:13.829 --> 00:52:16.670
not a comedian. I guess, like, sometimes it wouldn't

00:52:16.670 --> 00:52:19.070
mind being a clown. But it's literally trying

00:52:19.070 --> 00:52:21.670
to find these opportunities, these fleeting moments

00:52:21.670 --> 00:52:24.969
that can add some sparkle and fizz to our conversations

00:52:24.969 --> 00:52:29.469
so we don't get bored. Yeah. It's the antidote

00:52:29.469 --> 00:52:34.130
to boredom. Yeah. Absolutely. Sparkle and fizz.

00:52:34.130 --> 00:52:37.920
I mean, sign me up, right? To me, that's exactly

00:52:37.920 --> 00:52:39.599
what you bring into conversations with your son

00:52:39.599 --> 00:52:41.360
when you're like, whoa, whoa, whoa. This is not

00:52:41.360 --> 00:52:43.280
working. Let's do this again. You're bringing

00:52:43.280 --> 00:52:46.480
that levity. And you don't have to be a comedian,

00:52:46.579 --> 00:52:50.099
right? It's okay if we're not all Steve Carell

00:52:50.099 --> 00:52:52.940
or Nate Bargatze. I'm not quick on my feet like

00:52:52.940 --> 00:52:55.159
that. I'm not going to have these hilarious jokes.

00:52:55.539 --> 00:52:58.539
That's just not me. My brother -in -law, that

00:52:58.539 --> 00:53:00.460
dude is hilarious. I guess no matter what the

00:53:00.460 --> 00:53:02.579
situation, he's always going to have this quick

00:53:02.579 --> 00:53:04.980
-witted thing to say. He just cracks us all up.

00:53:05.000 --> 00:53:07.639
What a gift. That's not me. Like, it's just not.

00:53:08.519 --> 00:53:11.360
But with small little things, you can bring that

00:53:11.360 --> 00:53:13.280
sparkle and fizz. You can bring that levity that

00:53:13.280 --> 00:53:15.179
just can make it a little bit more interesting,

00:53:15.320 --> 00:53:19.380
a little bit more fun. And my suggestion to people

00:53:19.380 --> 00:53:21.940
would be, if you're not the comedian, which I'm

00:53:21.940 --> 00:53:23.800
not, have some phrases. Like, we've already talked

00:53:23.800 --> 00:53:25.460
about some. Just have some of those things on

00:53:25.460 --> 00:53:28.719
hand. Just bust them out. Yeah. I may have told

00:53:28.719 --> 00:53:31.380
you this in our pre -meeting, but I met this

00:53:31.380 --> 00:53:36.800
principal at a school. And he's on a board of

00:53:36.800 --> 00:53:40.039
directors with me. And the other day when I went

00:53:40.039 --> 00:53:42.300
up to say hi to him at this race that we were

00:53:42.300 --> 00:53:45.320
at, I asked him how he was doing, right? Hey,

00:53:45.360 --> 00:53:47.559
how are you, man? He was like, best day of my

00:53:47.559 --> 00:53:51.239
life. Yeah. And I was like, whoa. Tell me more.

00:53:51.380 --> 00:53:54.119
All right. I'm live in. Let's go. He's like,

00:53:54.119 --> 00:53:55.860
that's what I always tell my kids. He's like,

00:53:55.900 --> 00:53:58.159
when my kids get at school, because he's a principal,

00:53:58.239 --> 00:53:59.659
and they come up and talk to me and they ask

00:53:59.659 --> 00:54:00.900
how I am. That's what I always say, best day

00:54:00.900 --> 00:54:02.630
of my life. Because it's something that's different.

00:54:02.690 --> 00:54:04.590
And it's fun. He's got a big smile on his face.

00:54:04.670 --> 00:54:06.550
I'm like, that's just it. You don't have to be

00:54:06.550 --> 00:54:08.510
a comedian, right? You just like have something

00:54:08.510 --> 00:54:10.110
like that. You just bring a little bit more like

00:54:10.110 --> 00:54:13.349
oomph to, a little bit more sparkle to. Absolutely.

00:54:13.409 --> 00:54:14.789
It can make things just a little bit more fun.

00:54:14.849 --> 00:54:18.250
You can smile with your eyes. You can just totally

00:54:18.250 --> 00:54:21.349
show the people that you're there. You're open

00:54:21.349 --> 00:54:23.730
for business. Let's talk about it. I'm here.

00:54:23.989 --> 00:54:27.030
Yeah. And I think the sparkle and fizz, to me

00:54:27.030 --> 00:54:29.610
as well, when I think about it in that way, can

00:54:29.610 --> 00:54:33.360
go a long way. What sometimes are really difficult

00:54:33.360 --> 00:54:35.800
conversations are hard conversations. Because

00:54:35.800 --> 00:54:39.280
you don't want to be necessarily a comedian in

00:54:39.280 --> 00:54:42.719
those moments, right? You don't want to bring

00:54:42.719 --> 00:54:46.360
light -mindedness to a serious topic sometimes,

00:54:46.519 --> 00:54:49.639
right? But there's nothing wrong with bringing

00:54:49.639 --> 00:54:51.159
a little bit of sparkle and fizz to it, right?

00:54:51.380 --> 00:54:53.460
Even if it's serious, it doesn't have to be like

00:54:53.460 --> 00:54:58.179
so somber the whole time. And it's an art because

00:54:58.179 --> 00:54:59.860
you got to be careful. Oh, for sure. You got

00:54:59.860 --> 00:55:02.710
to be careful. I still think, though, that a

00:55:02.710 --> 00:55:05.210
little bit of sparkle and fizz goes a long way

00:55:05.210 --> 00:55:08.650
in those serious conversations. That's my thought.

00:55:08.710 --> 00:55:11.710
What do you think? Yeah, I agree. You have to

00:55:11.710 --> 00:55:13.710
play to your audience, and there's a time and

00:55:13.710 --> 00:55:17.329
a place for things, for sure. It depends. You

00:55:17.329 --> 00:55:20.570
have to feel through it, right? Not everybody's

00:55:20.570 --> 00:55:25.429
going to want to laugh with you when you're going

00:55:25.429 --> 00:55:28.690
through and talking about divorce or death or

00:55:28.690 --> 00:55:32.829
something like that. But asking questions and

00:55:32.829 --> 00:55:37.550
trying to, you know, maybe it's not necessarily

00:55:37.550 --> 00:55:40.090
being funny or bringing humor, but that's where

00:55:40.090 --> 00:55:43.610
you can use other phrases that are maybe, you

00:55:43.610 --> 00:55:47.989
know, more authentic or warm, making light of

00:55:47.989 --> 00:55:50.190
yourself somehow, you know, things like that

00:55:50.190 --> 00:55:54.170
that you can have in your back pocket to make

00:55:54.170 --> 00:55:58.929
the other person hopefully feel safe to communicate.

00:55:59.409 --> 00:56:04.170
Yeah. Yeah, for sure. And I think it does play

00:56:04.170 --> 00:56:06.389
in really nicely as well to the next one, which

00:56:06.389 --> 00:56:09.929
is K, kindness. Because, you know, you've got

00:56:09.929 --> 00:56:12.389
to find the right moments for the levity, right?

00:56:12.570 --> 00:56:14.769
You've got to be aware of what it is. I mean,

00:56:14.789 --> 00:56:17.769
the kindness, you can always bring the kindness.

00:56:18.429 --> 00:56:20.489
Like serious conversations, fun conversations,

00:56:20.809 --> 00:56:23.570
everything in between, you can always bring a

00:56:23.570 --> 00:56:27.090
degree of kindness, right? Here's what I wrote

00:56:27.090 --> 00:56:31.789
down from Allison on this one. In a way, topics,

00:56:32.090 --> 00:56:34.510
asking, and levity are all working their way

00:56:34.510 --> 00:56:37.150
up to the most important maximum of the talk

00:56:37.150 --> 00:56:40.250
framework, which is kindness. Ultimately, the

00:56:40.250 --> 00:56:43.650
question is in service of what? Are you becoming

00:56:43.650 --> 00:56:45.730
a better conversationalist to pursue your own

00:56:45.730 --> 00:56:48.269
goals and needs? Or are you thinking about other

00:56:48.269 --> 00:56:53.269
people's goals and needs? And give me your take

00:56:53.269 --> 00:57:02.130
on that. Well. It's kind of like the one -upping

00:57:02.130 --> 00:57:03.869
thing we were talking about earlier, right? Are

00:57:03.869 --> 00:57:08.210
you holding space for your person to communicate

00:57:08.210 --> 00:57:13.489
clearly? Are you there to show that it's a safe

00:57:13.489 --> 00:57:15.909
place for that person? Or are you out for your

00:57:15.909 --> 00:57:18.750
own agenda? Is it a platform for you to just

00:57:18.750 --> 00:57:25.989
take over? I think listening is where it is sort

00:57:25.989 --> 00:57:29.260
of. underneath the kindness umbrella too? And

00:57:29.260 --> 00:57:33.300
how are you an active listener? How are you really

00:57:33.300 --> 00:57:35.840
hearing what that person is saying? And are you

00:57:35.840 --> 00:57:39.079
making eye contact? And are you showing the person

00:57:39.079 --> 00:57:43.559
that you're there? And I mean, that's how I would

00:57:43.559 --> 00:57:48.539
take that. Yeah. Yeah. I totally agree. I think

00:57:48.539 --> 00:57:51.679
it goes back to kind of what our motivations

00:57:51.679 --> 00:57:55.760
are, right? Just like you said. And when the

00:57:55.760 --> 00:57:57.440
motivations are in the right place, it's easier

00:57:57.440 --> 00:57:59.860
to then have that kindness come out. Kindness

00:57:59.860 --> 00:58:04.360
is rooted in empathy. And so the lack of empathy

00:58:04.360 --> 00:58:07.400
and just being selfish is going to rob you of

00:58:07.400 --> 00:58:10.440
your ability to be truly kind. I think people

00:58:10.440 --> 00:58:14.480
could mask that by saying nice or flattering

00:58:14.480 --> 00:58:17.840
things, but those are surface level and they're

00:58:17.840 --> 00:58:20.239
not genuine. Yeah, it has to be authentic or

00:58:20.239 --> 00:58:25.570
it's not going to be delivered. Yeah. And my

00:58:25.570 --> 00:58:27.929
wife and I, we have this discussion a lot of

00:58:27.929 --> 00:58:30.630
times because for me as an attorney, words matter,

00:58:30.750 --> 00:58:33.489
but also like the delivery of those words matter.

00:58:33.590 --> 00:58:35.530
If I'm in court, the way I'm delivering it matters.

00:58:35.730 --> 00:58:37.670
If it's gotta be in front of a jury, it matters.

00:58:37.809 --> 00:58:40.070
Even if it's just in front of a judge, it matters.

00:58:40.550 --> 00:58:43.030
So sometimes I annoy her a little bit because

00:58:43.030 --> 00:58:44.969
I like to talk about like the delivery, right?

00:58:45.050 --> 00:58:47.429
Like the delivery matters. It's like, oh, I can't

00:58:47.429 --> 00:58:48.789
always say it the right way. And I'm like, you're

00:58:48.789 --> 00:58:50.050
right. You're right. I got to have some empathy

00:58:50.050 --> 00:58:52.070
for that. Like, I can't always expect to be said

00:58:52.070 --> 00:58:56.469
the right way. I do think, though, that the delivery

00:58:56.469 --> 00:58:59.130
style can make a big difference in my ability

00:58:59.130 --> 00:59:01.210
to receive things, especially when it's like

00:59:01.210 --> 00:59:04.030
feedback or criticism. Or disagreements. Yeah.

00:59:04.070 --> 00:59:07.710
Right. Acknowledging first. And yeah, I agree.

00:59:08.010 --> 00:59:10.130
Which is, I'm so glad you said that because it

00:59:10.130 --> 00:59:12.710
reminded me about one of the things that Allison

00:59:12.710 --> 00:59:14.949
talks a lot about in a lot of our materials.

00:59:15.739 --> 00:59:17.639
And it's the acknowledgement or validation of

00:59:17.639 --> 00:59:20.760
the other person first, which is like the whole

00:59:20.760 --> 00:59:25.300
crux of our podcast, yes and. Because that's

00:59:25.300 --> 00:59:30.619
the idea, which is the yes and is a tool or a

00:59:30.619 --> 00:59:34.239
mechanism to validate somebody else's perspective

00:59:34.239 --> 00:59:39.440
to them and build on it so that we don't tear

00:59:39.440 --> 00:59:42.599
it down and we don't immediately just disagree.

00:59:43.800 --> 00:59:46.519
They're just saying that you can disagree without

00:59:46.519 --> 00:59:50.480
being disagreeable. And I love that because I

00:59:50.480 --> 00:59:53.380
do think it's important, like, the way that we're

00:59:53.380 --> 00:59:56.199
going to disagree with somebody matters. Because,

00:59:56.260 --> 00:59:57.880
again, it comes back to, like, what is it we're

00:59:57.880 --> 01:00:00.199
bringing to the table? How can we have a healthy

01:00:00.199 --> 01:00:03.619
discussion that's still rooted in kindness and

01:00:03.619 --> 01:00:06.539
empathy? And yes and goes a long way into doing

01:00:06.539 --> 01:00:10.579
that. Yes being the acknowledgement and building

01:00:10.579 --> 01:00:14.269
on it instead of a yes but. Yes, but being the

01:00:14.269 --> 01:00:16.030
but sweep where we sweep away what was said before,

01:00:16.170 --> 01:00:18.170
we really invalidated even though we said yes.

01:00:18.590 --> 01:00:21.789
The yes and is something I think a lot of people

01:00:21.789 --> 01:00:23.710
could incorporate better. It would be a tool

01:00:23.710 --> 01:00:28.050
to continue conversations. Yeah. Such a powerful

01:00:28.050 --> 01:00:35.230
thing to practice. Yeah. Okay. So what, when

01:00:35.230 --> 01:00:38.190
you're going into a hard conversation with a

01:00:38.190 --> 01:00:43.800
client, a significant other, kid. What what mantras

01:00:43.800 --> 01:00:47.119
or things do you tell yourself going into it

01:00:47.119 --> 01:00:48.960
right before you do it to kind of prep yourself

01:00:48.960 --> 01:00:54.820
for that conversation? Just trying to be as curious

01:00:54.820 --> 01:00:57.980
as possible. Help me understand. Ask better questions.

01:00:59.940 --> 01:01:02.920
You know, tell me more about why we're here.

01:01:03.119 --> 01:01:07.400
How did we get here? How can I help? That's more

01:01:07.400 --> 01:01:13.110
my son for sure. With clients, understanding

01:01:13.110 --> 01:01:15.730
or acknowledging the way that they're feeling,

01:01:15.869 --> 01:01:18.110
it makes sense that you feel this way. How can

01:01:18.110 --> 01:01:22.289
I support you? Where do we go from here? So a

01:01:22.289 --> 01:01:28.090
lot of questions, a lot of just reassuring them

01:01:28.090 --> 01:01:32.489
that I hear them where they are. I hear the emotions.

01:01:32.650 --> 01:01:36.510
I understand where you are. How can we move forward?

01:01:36.829 --> 01:01:39.400
Yeah. What do you need from me? How can I help?

01:01:39.559 --> 01:01:41.980
You know, sometimes that's just the easiest question

01:01:41.980 --> 01:01:45.460
to ask. What do you need from me? Yeah. Yeah.

01:01:45.519 --> 01:01:48.820
It can be really effective because then they

01:01:48.820 --> 01:01:52.199
know you care. Yeah. And I don't have a ton of

01:01:52.199 --> 01:01:55.820
conflict resolution with my clients. Maybe something

01:01:55.820 --> 01:01:57.420
they're going through if they're going through

01:01:57.420 --> 01:01:59.739
a divorce, right? And so we can talk through

01:01:59.739 --> 01:02:03.179
it, but it's not, you know, there's not a ton

01:02:03.179 --> 01:02:10.119
of conflict there. Yeah, I mean, and then just

01:02:10.119 --> 01:02:11.960
helping them understand, like, they don't always

01:02:11.960 --> 01:02:15.840
have to engage in conflict, too. Sometimes you

01:02:15.840 --> 01:02:22.159
can just step away or just say, noted. Okay,

01:02:22.300 --> 01:02:25.780
I hear you. I understand. That's an interesting

01:02:25.780 --> 01:02:28.199
perspective. And walk away. Yeah, because there's

01:02:28.199 --> 01:02:30.980
some times where that relationship, for whatever

01:02:30.980 --> 01:02:33.699
reason, is not going to get built. And so you

01:02:33.699 --> 01:02:35.719
don't continue down that pathway because it's

01:02:35.719 --> 01:02:37.400
something where you've got to sometimes have

01:02:37.400 --> 01:02:39.880
a healthy boundary and be like, okay, got it.

01:02:40.019 --> 01:02:42.179
I'm going to end the conversation. Yeah. For

01:02:42.179 --> 01:02:46.179
sure. Okay. So I'm going to take us to a quick,

01:02:46.219 --> 01:02:48.179
a couple of quick fun segments. Okay. You ready

01:02:48.179 --> 01:02:50.980
for these? Sure. First one's this or that. This

01:02:50.980 --> 01:02:53.159
or that. Okay. Okay. So this or that is you just

01:02:53.159 --> 01:02:54.940
tell me which one you think. Okay. Okay. Even,

01:02:55.019 --> 01:02:56.820
even if I think it's wrong, it's totally fine.

01:02:57.219 --> 01:03:00.599
Okay. I'll tell you if I think it is. I'm just

01:03:00.599 --> 01:03:04.449
kidding. Okay. Ariel's secret treasure grotto

01:03:04.449 --> 01:03:12.570
or Eric's castle? Ariel's secrets for sure. Okay.

01:03:12.590 --> 01:03:15.050
You like her little thing that she's got where

01:03:15.050 --> 01:03:16.789
she's collected all the human items. Who doesn't

01:03:16.789 --> 01:03:19.809
want like a secret hut of treasures? It is pretty

01:03:19.809 --> 01:03:24.130
cool. It is pretty cool. Okay. Scuttle or Sebastian?

01:03:25.849 --> 01:03:30.429
Scuttle. No, Sebastian. Sebastian. Sebastian?

01:03:30.809 --> 01:03:33.960
Yeah. It's their best friend and there's warmth

01:03:33.960 --> 01:03:38.119
and it's like a dog, you know, having that connection

01:03:38.119 --> 01:03:40.760
for sure. I love Sebastian. I love Under the

01:03:40.760 --> 01:03:43.159
Sea. So for me, it's Sebastian because of Under

01:03:43.159 --> 01:03:46.019
the Sea. But Scuttle is a funny character. Oh,

01:03:46.039 --> 01:03:48.400
no, I'm thinking of Sebastian. Are you thinking

01:03:48.400 --> 01:03:50.059
of Flounder? I was thinking of Flounder when

01:03:50.059 --> 01:03:52.119
I said that. So I thought Flounder. Okay, no,

01:03:52.199 --> 01:03:56.340
Sebastian. Sebastian. Sebastian. And he is the

01:03:56.340 --> 01:04:00.079
empathy character of that movie, I think. There

01:04:00.079 --> 01:04:02.800
is no movie without Sebastian. Yeah. So, yes,

01:04:02.800 --> 01:04:07.739
you're right. Okay. Long walk in the park or

01:04:07.739 --> 01:04:11.940
being in a coffee shop with background noise?

01:04:12.260 --> 01:04:16.639
Ooh, that's hard. Both. I probably go to the

01:04:16.639 --> 01:04:21.340
coffee shop more, but I love walking. Long walks.

01:04:21.460 --> 01:04:25.059
Love it. I got to make you choose. I know. That's

01:04:25.059 --> 01:04:27.739
the this or that. The long walk. Okay. I'm a

01:04:27.739 --> 01:04:31.639
hiker. I'm a hiker for sure. I like to get lost

01:04:31.639 --> 01:04:36.340
in the woods. Phone call or face -to -face? Face

01:04:36.340 --> 01:04:39.539
-to -face. Oh, yeah. I don't love talking on

01:04:39.539 --> 01:04:42.860
the phone, like at all. I know. It seems to be

01:04:42.860 --> 01:04:45.400
going away with the times, right? You're either

01:04:45.400 --> 01:04:49.340
texting, which is terrible because phone calls

01:04:49.340 --> 01:04:51.659
allow you to hear the tone of voice. It does.

01:04:52.019 --> 01:04:54.320
So it helps more with connection. But yeah, people

01:04:54.320 --> 01:04:57.099
want to text or they... In person, for sure.

01:04:57.099 --> 01:05:00.780
I have been turned on to the idea of voice memos

01:05:00.780 --> 01:05:04.719
in recent weeks. Or even Marco Polos. Because

01:05:04.719 --> 01:05:06.119
then you get a little more context from the person.

01:05:06.260 --> 01:05:08.920
But then they can listen and watch at their convenience.

01:05:09.300 --> 01:05:10.940
Yeah. So if they're not available for a phone

01:05:10.940 --> 01:05:12.980
call. And I can see value in that. Yeah. Because

01:05:12.980 --> 01:05:14.579
then you can see the body language or hear the,

01:05:14.579 --> 01:05:17.059
you know, tone, reflection in their voice a little

01:05:17.059 --> 01:05:22.679
bit better. Okay. Ask the first question or give

01:05:22.679 --> 01:05:27.059
the first compliment. I ask a lot of questions.

01:05:27.699 --> 01:05:28.920
So you're going to go with ask the first question.

01:05:29.219 --> 01:05:35.340
Okay. Yeah. I like it. I like it. Dinner party

01:05:35.340 --> 01:05:40.139
or late night one -on -one conversation? Ooh,

01:05:40.139 --> 01:05:43.760
dinner party. Yeah, same. I'm a dinner party

01:05:43.760 --> 01:05:45.980
guy. Love it. I love me a good party. They're

01:05:45.980 --> 01:05:48.760
super fun. Yeah. Okay. Here's a rapid fire, okay?

01:05:48.900 --> 01:05:50.500
Okay. It's the first one that comes to your mind.

01:05:50.599 --> 01:05:53.139
Okay. Okay. You ready for this? Yeah. Favorite

01:05:53.139 --> 01:05:56.530
Disney movie? Little Mermaid. Okay. Perfect.

01:05:56.809 --> 01:06:00.789
Favorite Disney song? The Frozen one. Let It

01:06:00.789 --> 01:06:04.650
Go. Let It Go. Oh, classic. So good. So good.

01:06:05.070 --> 01:06:10.630
Favorite Disney princess? Ariel. Favorite Disney

01:06:10.630 --> 01:06:23.750
villain? I'm trying to think of them all. You

01:06:23.750 --> 01:06:26.849
got... Ursula, obviously. You got Jafar. You

01:06:26.849 --> 01:06:33.210
got Hades. You got Maleficent. You've got Gothel.

01:06:33.429 --> 01:06:37.070
You've got... I love Maleficent. Yeah, a lot

01:06:37.070 --> 01:06:39.650
of people do. Is that what you're going to go

01:06:39.650 --> 01:06:42.630
with? Yeah, I'll go with that. Okay. It's not

01:06:42.630 --> 01:06:44.750
a bad pick. It's not a bad pick. And I don't

01:06:44.750 --> 01:06:47.469
know if you're a Disneyland or Disney World gal,

01:06:47.550 --> 01:06:48.829
but we're going to go with this question anyways.

01:06:49.389 --> 01:06:55.050
Favorite Disney ride? So I went to Disneyland

01:06:55.050 --> 01:06:58.969
a couple years ago and the Star Wars, everything

01:06:58.969 --> 01:07:01.590
Star Wars, that was like our favorite, but I

01:07:01.590 --> 01:07:04.510
don't know of any of the Disney rides beyond

01:07:04.510 --> 01:07:07.650
that. Yeah, in the Star Wars, you've got Smuggler's

01:07:07.650 --> 01:07:10.969
Run, which is like you're in the Millennium Falcon

01:07:10.969 --> 01:07:12.010
and you're just kind of sitting there and you're

01:07:12.010 --> 01:07:16.650
either the pilot or you're shooting the guns

01:07:16.650 --> 01:07:18.769
or you're the engineer in the back, right? There's

01:07:18.769 --> 01:07:22.170
those six spots right to each side. Or then the

01:07:22.170 --> 01:07:26.190
superior ride, which is now I can't remember

01:07:26.190 --> 01:07:27.710
the name of it. Why can I remember the name of

01:07:27.710 --> 01:07:33.190
it? I don't know. But then I will say cars. The

01:07:33.190 --> 01:07:38.030
cars ride was that was the best roller like roller

01:07:38.030 --> 01:07:40.949
coaster experience. But the line was so long

01:07:40.949 --> 01:07:43.869
that it was. Oh, it can be. Yeah. You got to

01:07:43.869 --> 01:07:46.190
be real careful. You get the lightning lane or

01:07:46.190 --> 01:07:48.639
you got to go the single rider. At Cars. Yeah.

01:07:48.760 --> 01:07:50.659
Because waiting in the whole regular line for

01:07:50.659 --> 01:07:53.460
Cars, that's for the birds. Like it could be

01:07:53.460 --> 01:07:57.320
two hours. It was at least that. Yeah. The other

01:07:57.320 --> 01:08:00.639
Star Wars ride is Rise of the Resistance, which

01:08:00.639 --> 01:08:04.139
is phenomenal. It's like such an amazing. To

01:08:04.139 --> 01:08:06.739
me, it's the greatest ride experience ever created.

01:08:06.840 --> 01:08:09.139
But it's amazing. Is that when you're in the

01:08:09.139 --> 01:08:11.320
car and you're on the thing? Because that was

01:08:11.320 --> 01:08:14.000
really cool. Yes. We could have spent the entire

01:08:14.000 --> 01:08:17.899
weekend in just the Star Wars place. Yeah, they've

01:08:17.899 --> 01:08:20.020
done a great job with Star Wars Land for sure.

01:08:20.100 --> 01:08:25.340
So fun. Okay. Favorite book. This is a non -Disney

01:08:25.340 --> 01:08:28.399
question. Oh. Favorite book. The Secret Prayer.

01:08:28.899 --> 01:08:31.739
The Secret Prayer. Who's that by? Joe Vitale.

01:08:32.260 --> 01:08:33.880
Okay. We're going to link that in the notes.

01:08:34.079 --> 01:08:35.659
We're going to link that in the notes. Okay.

01:08:35.920 --> 01:08:37.239
I've never heard it before. I'm going to have

01:08:37.239 --> 01:08:39.199
to read it. I'm going to have to read it. What's

01:08:39.199 --> 01:08:43.659
your favorite AI large language model? Claude.

01:08:44.460 --> 01:08:46.979
Claude. Yeah. When did Claude take over for you?

01:08:47.279 --> 01:08:50.300
When was that transition? Long ago. Long ago.

01:08:50.399 --> 01:08:55.039
I use them all, but I love Claude for writing

01:08:55.039 --> 01:09:00.039
and for coding and for workflows and all my apps

01:09:00.039 --> 01:09:05.300
and DIYs and stuff. I like ChatGPT because they

01:09:05.300 --> 01:09:10.500
have the GPTs so I can get specific on certain

01:09:10.500 --> 01:09:13.619
things sometimes. I use them all, but Claude's

01:09:13.619 --> 01:09:17.180
my go -to favorite. Same. Before I knew Claude,

01:09:17.199 --> 01:09:19.159
it was Chad GPT just because that's the one that

01:09:19.159 --> 01:09:20.600
I was familiar with. But as soon as I figured

01:09:20.600 --> 01:09:22.920
out Claude, like, well, I'm in that all the time.

01:09:22.960 --> 01:09:26.800
Love it. Okay. What is your number one piece

01:09:26.800 --> 01:09:30.060
of advice to someone getting divorced? Number

01:09:30.060 --> 01:09:34.840
one piece of advice. So am I, like, I'm advocating

01:09:34.840 --> 01:09:39.060
for this person? No. I'm just, just like my friends

01:09:39.060 --> 01:09:41.880
getting divorced? Start collecting your data.

01:09:42.060 --> 01:09:45.960
Get your, get organized. Okay. Get your inventory

01:09:45.960 --> 01:09:48.840
together. Let's figure out where everything is.

01:09:49.039 --> 01:09:52.399
Get your tax returns. Get some cash. Put your

01:09:52.399 --> 01:09:56.079
cash in your account. It's marital. We're not

01:09:56.079 --> 01:09:58.460
going to lie about it. But you're going to need

01:09:58.460 --> 01:10:03.619
it. That is so a numbers person response. Because

01:10:03.619 --> 01:10:05.199
you told us. You told us you were numbers. You

01:10:05.199 --> 01:10:07.439
love the numbers. You love this and that. And

01:10:07.439 --> 01:10:08.699
I was like, yep, that is. Well, what are we going

01:10:08.699 --> 01:10:11.119
to fight about, right? Let's not fight about

01:10:11.119 --> 01:10:13.359
the numbers. Let's just have that be the easy

01:10:13.359 --> 01:10:18.619
part. For sure. For sure. Well, as we wrap up,

01:10:18.859 --> 01:10:23.060
give us maybe kind of your overall takeaway from

01:10:23.060 --> 01:10:31.560
this topic of communication and about Allison's

01:10:31.560 --> 01:10:34.680
book, Talk. And then we'll lead that right into

01:10:34.680 --> 01:10:37.560
our three actionable takeaways. So high level,

01:10:37.699 --> 01:10:39.859
overall, kind of wrapping it up, and then three

01:10:39.859 --> 01:10:43.520
actionable takeaways. High level, I think, you

01:10:43.520 --> 01:10:47.000
know, the more you can practice T -A -L -N -K,

01:10:47.239 --> 01:10:49.659
the better communicator you'll be, which will

01:10:49.659 --> 01:10:53.579
trickle into every aspect of your life. So I

01:10:53.579 --> 01:10:57.000
think it's worth practicing, studying, and improving

01:10:57.000 --> 01:11:02.420
upon. Yeah, I love it. Yeah. Okay, so what are

01:11:02.420 --> 01:11:05.680
our three actionable takeaways? Top takeaways.

01:11:05.720 --> 01:11:08.500
I'm going to say, number one, topics. Be prepared.

01:11:09.050 --> 01:11:11.890
Spend a little time to be prepared. Ask better

01:11:11.890 --> 01:11:16.989
questions that will just make you connect with

01:11:16.989 --> 01:11:22.130
your person. And listen. Be an active listener.

01:11:22.430 --> 01:11:26.250
Show the person you care. Fabulous. I love it.

01:11:26.329 --> 01:11:28.289
Yeah. Thank you so much for being on with us

01:11:28.289 --> 01:11:30.109
today. Of course. Great conversation. I know.

01:11:30.170 --> 01:11:33.989
It was fun. As you lead this conversation, remember

01:11:33.989 --> 01:11:37.050
that yes, the past can hurt. And you can either

01:11:37.050 --> 01:11:40.369
run from it or you can learn from it. So here's

01:11:40.369 --> 01:11:44.010
to learning and finding joy in the journey. See

01:11:44.010 --> 01:11:44.489
you real soon.