"Those Guys: NFL Combine & Free Agency Special"

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Alex Hardy: Hey, we are back.

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It's those guys.

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I'm Alex Hardy, and with me, Nick
Ferguson, the latest from the NFL.

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Following out the combine in Indianapolis,
plus some exciting free agency news

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right before the league here starts.

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Nick Ferguson, what's going on, my man?

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Nick Ferguson: Nothing much, man.

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Another glorious day.

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Alex Hardy: Another glorious day,
especially if you are a Tampa Bucca.

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Tampa Bay Buccaneers fan.

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Mike Evans is staying on a two
year, 52 million contract extension.

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One that I think is in line with what the
market was kind of willing to bear out.

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He's going to be entering his age 31
season, but a guy coming off an NFL

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record, 10 straight, 1, 000 yard seasons,
led the NFL, uh, 13 touchdowns last year.

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But moving forward, maybe he
could have expected a larger deal.

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out on the market, but at the same
time, the Buccaneers look like

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they're going to be running it back.

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And maybe that points to Baker
Mayfield staying in Tampa as well.

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Nick Ferguson: Well, you know, during
the free agent period, that's always

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kind of the idea that a guy hits the
market and he's looking for a larger bag.

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But in this case, with Mike Evans, you
just said it 10 years in the same place

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and the Buccaneers would have seen that
drafted, you know, Mike Evans, I think

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seventh overall coming out of Texas A& M.

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And you think about the familiarity
with the particular city, town,

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and the coaches that he's got to
know from an offensive standpoint.

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And finally, after Brady, the
question was like, okay, what was

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going to happen with the Buccaneers
or the quarterback position?

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Now, Baker came out last year,
had a sensational season, and Mike

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Evans, once again, had a phenomenal
career and season last year.

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So, yeah, you could go
get a bag somewhere else.

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But once again, You're 30 years old.

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Teams are now going to wonder how
many more years you have left.

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So you might as well stay
where you are, stay put.

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And then here's the biggest thing that
I think a lot of free agents kind of

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get kind of caught up in the wash.

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Mike's been playing in Tampa
for a long period of time.

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It's the state of Florida.

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The taxes are not that high, right?

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So you may get another wide receiver who's
making the same amount that Mike is making

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in Miami, but he's playing in New York.

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But guess who is putting
more money in their pocket?

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It is Mike Evans, so it is great.

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But here's what it means for
the fans of Tampa Bay, uh, Alex.

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It means as though now the team can shift
their attention to, uh, Winfield Jr.

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And also bring it back to Baker Mayfield.

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Because there's no way Mike Evans
agrees to this without having

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some reassurance that Baker
Mayfield would be his quarterback.

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Alex Hardy: That's right.

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And it seemingly, you know, the priority,
they were coming in the Buccaneers

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with about 44 million in cap space.

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I don't know if it's a priority
or just order of operations.

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They took care of their
longest tenured veteran.

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Winfield is arguably one of the
best players at the safety position,

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which I'm thrilled to break down
with you as this offseason continues.

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Plus, the quarterback situation.

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But getting Evans first Is a sign that
they're valuing their guys in house,

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and most importantly, not letting
them test the free agent market.

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So we'll see how that bears for Baker
Mayfield, and for the Buccaneers as a

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whole, because, you know, Dave Canales,
who was kind of the key to that play

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calling, is now in their division
rivals with Carolina, so they bring

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in a first time NFL OC in Liam Cohen.

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Continuity is key, so you're right,
I'd be shocked if they look in

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another direction than Baker Mayfield.

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And if that's the case, if he's going to
agree to a deal even before hitting free

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agency, but maybe he hits free agency,
it just takes one team to try to outbid

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Tampa in order to procure his services.

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We'll get to the actual participants
in the NFL combine in Indianapolis, but

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reading the tea leaves and reporting, um,
from Diana Rossini of the athletic and

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Adam Schefter of ESPN and Ian Rappaport
of the NFL network, there's growing

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sentiment that Baker was one of those
guys in free agency that is drawing

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interest, but not coveted as quite as
much as the Kirk Cousins, the 35 year

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old coming off an Achilles surgery is
garnering the most interest out of any

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veteran quarterback for teams that have
to weigh the decision on the veteran

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quarterback route versus taking one of
those top signal callers in April's draft.

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Nick Ferguson: Well, the reason
individuals are looking that way around

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the league and I and Kirk Cousins,
because you mentioned the experience.

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I mean, we've seen Kirk Cousins
put up a lot of yards and.

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Those coaching on the opposite side of the
ball, that's what they want to do because

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it's become somewhat of an arms race.

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Here's my only knock on Kirk Cousins,
Alex, is that while he may be a great

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fantasy quarterback and might help
you win your fantasy league, he's not

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helping you in a really real world where
games really truly count and coaches get

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fired and hired based on that outcome.

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So I see why there's a lure and attraction
to Kirk Cousins, but other than that.

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I really don't because once again,
you got a guy who wasn't very

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mobile before he got injured.

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Now he's coming off an injury.

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When will he be back?

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When will he be at his
highest of the game?

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And then you still need to have
someone in waiting just in case

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there's any kind of setbacks.

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The one thing that the younger
quarterbacks provide for you, one

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is you, and they may have a little
inexperience, but then it's the

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price tag that comes along with it.

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See, that's where I'm thinking
from an economic standpoint.

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Listen, I'll get that young guy.

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We may separate through one or two years,
but if we put talent around him, that

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guy would be a quality performer for me.

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But what has Kirk done in his
time in the NFL other than

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putting up great fantasy numbers?

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Alex Hardy: Kirk is unique in the
perspective of, you talk about

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the compensation for him, right?

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The fully guaranteed contracts.

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He's, throughout his NFL
career, amassed 230 million.

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And so you could make the argument
that, hey, if the Vikings want to run

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it back, like the way that it appears
the Buccaneers are starting to do,

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maybe he'll take a hometown discount.

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His kids are, you know, his
kids are comfortable there.

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They've been there a long time.

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But at the same time, if.

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They're looking to go
in another direction.

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I think why he was a great fit with
Minnesota and he would be the most coveted

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free agent quarterback is because of the
familiarity and a Kyle Shanahan system,

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something you can talk about at great
detail that there are what half a dozen

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coaches that come from the Shanahan
tree that are running a similar style of

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offense that you could just plug a Kirk
cousins into and get them over the top.

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And.

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You know, why not a team like Atlanta
take a swing at Kirk Cousins if they

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feel they have the pieces around
them, even though they are sitting

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there with the eighth overall pick.

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You can talk yourself into Kirk
with a number of teams, it seems

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Nick Ferguson: like, Nick.

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Well, you, you can talk yourself into
virtually almost anything, Alex, but you

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got to say, well, where the rubber meets
the road, what seemed to be more rational?

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Like when you think about Kyle
Shanahan being in San Francisco

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and also being the offensive
coordinator for the Atlanta Falcons.

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Matt Ryan was that guy.

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Kind of like the Kirk Cousins guy.

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How far can those guys actually get you?

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Like, you play against uh, the
Kansas City Chiefs uh, what, twice?

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Three times?

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One with, you know, once with Brock
Purdy, another with Jimmy Garoppolo.

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And you've lost to them every single time.

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So the idea, you gotta try
something out different.

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Kyle tried to.

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You know, selecting Trey Lance,
but we never really got a chance

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to see Trey because of his injury.

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The one thing that is a glaring thing
for me, look around the NFL and look

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to see how many mobile quarterbacks
that you have within the NFC and the A

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FC and ask yourself, can you be avoid
a talent in that particular area?

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And I say no.

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Mm-Hmm.

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granted a guy like her cousins
give you some leeway and keeps

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you in some of the games.

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But it comes down to, can
they win you the big one?

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And right now that's not happening.

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So I don't see this love affair
with Kirk Cousins going too

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Alex Hardy: well.

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Well, it's coming at the expense
of potentially Justin Fields.

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Now the sentiment coming from Indianapolis
from those, you know, that same in depth

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reporting is that if the bears are keeping
that first overall pick and selecting

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their signal caller, we can say Caleb
Williams or Jayden Daniels or Drake

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May, um, odds are it's Caleb Williams.

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That means that Justin Fields, his
potential destination, the spots

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are kind of drying up, right?

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Because if they want a veteran signal
caller that is ready to go, that has been

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a proven winner, it seems that Justin
Fields isn't necessarily being prioritized

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in the way that we could have imagined.

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And I'm not sure that just because
he started in Chicago, doesn't

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mean that he gets the kind of
trade package that You know, it

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was really enticing for the Bears.

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So maybe there's a route where
again, the Bears want to do their due

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diligence on this quarterback class
and just like a year ago, they were

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ready to trade that first overall
pick before free agency started.

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They want to move quickly.

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They may have to sell 75 cents on
the dollar for Justin Fields who you

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believe is still a dynamic player.

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Nick Ferguson: Yeah, I still believe
that just kind of look at what

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he's been able to do and I know Uh,
the numbers don't really show it

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depending on where you look at it.

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But, if you were really able to put his
numbers right next to Lamar Jackson,

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a guy with two time MVP, you would see
some of those numbers are quite similar.

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Just, just kind of, right

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Alex Hardy: above going at it.

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Nick Ferguson: I don't know, Nick.

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Touchdown to interception ratio
over the past, let's say, 20 games.

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Lamar has 28 touchdowns.

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Six or eight interceptions.

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You look at Justin Fields.

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He may have around 23 touchdowns and
may have 13 or 14 interceptions, but

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when you look at their ability to run
what they're able to do with the ball

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in their hands, I mean both quarterbacks
are dynamic and to kind of defend

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Justin Fields just a little more.

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It's almost like he suffers from
what every single quarterback that's

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been drafted in the first round
by the Bears had gone through.

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They have patience.

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Or supporting cast.

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So how do you know what a guy can do
if you don't really give him support?

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So with that first round pick
from Ryan polls, I moved back.

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You already have the number
one spot pick at number nine.

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You move back.

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You can get maybe another first,
a second in 2024, 2025, you keep

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fields, you build your defense.

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And you add another office
of weapon opposite DJ Moore.

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Now, would you like Marvin Hafferson jr?

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Of course.

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But if you can't get him,
you can get Roma Doomsday.

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So there are options out there.

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There's Xavier Worthy.

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So there's options out there.

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Yeah, but I know this whole thing
around this year, uh, centered around

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quarterback and what Ryan Poole has
to think about is, look, if we get

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rid of Fields now, we don't have to
worry about his fifth year option.

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We are able to reset our quarterback
market by drafting a young guy.

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And, We get a 50 option.

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The problem with that philosophy is
you haven't really built around it.

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That's the problem.

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Alex Hardy: Well, you think they can build
around them with that ninth pick, just

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like you'd make the argument for fields.

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Um, and if they get a day to pick, if
that's a second, potentially a third

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rounder as the discussion is going
on, then you just kind of have to see,

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um, and maybe extrapolate how Caleb
Williams was performing with an awful

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USC team a year ago, um, You point to
the numbers dipping and it comes back

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to the same argument, supporting cast.

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Now the quarterback class, let's, let's
transition for the, from the veterans

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to, you know, the, the news that was
going on and, uh, and indeed compared

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to the actual participants there, you
started to get into the wide receivers

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and they seem to have absolutely stolen.

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All of the buzz from the combine.

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Xavier Worthy, I mentioned, a record
421 40 yard dash at 165 pounds.

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It's great because now we have so much
data, we do things in context, right?

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Is it more impressive
that he runs the fastest?

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40 yard dash ever or
that his teammate, uh, A.

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D.

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Mitchell ran a 4 3 4 weighing almost
40 more pounds than, than Worthy does.

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Listen, 5.

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Everything is within context, but it's
interesting to see that this time a

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year ago, We're looking at a lot of
smaller wide receivers and finding

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success in Zaflowers and Tankdell.

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Uh, while other guys, like Quentin Johnson
of the Chargers, get vaulted up the draft

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board because they're one of the only guys
that had a combination of size and speed.

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Whereas this year, it, it, it bears,
you know, absolute, you know, dozens,

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you know, four or five guys that would
have been wide receiver one a year ago.

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So the performers that we saw, and
you mentioned Marvin Harrison Jr.

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Uh, we're, we're talking about the
Texas wide receivers, Roma Dunze, you

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talked about potentially for the bears,
uh, Malik neighbors and Brian Thomas.

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Let's just, I mean, grab a couple of
names, Nick, that whether based on

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testing numbers that you saw, or if
you're beginning to break down the

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film guys that really, really improve
their stock as we're finding the

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elite athletes are now playing the.

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Skilled positions.

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They're seeing where the money
is going and the best athletes

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are playing wide receiver

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Nick Ferguson: now.

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Well, this may watching the combine
this past week and watching so many

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guys perform Well, whether they were
at 165 or 220 pounds What it does in

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my mind it it could change the way
that the draft actually Kind of falls

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through because everyone has their
mock drafts and they have certain

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teams selecting at certain points

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Alex Hardy: But we have everything figured
out in the first week of March, right?

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Right,

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Nick Ferguson: right.

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But based on the speed, not just
at the wide receiver position, we

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have, we saw a fast linebacker group.

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We saw edge rushers, offensive linemen.

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Uh, we saw so many different
Position groups show, I mean, speed

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that we have never seen before.

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So it changes as far as what teams may
think as they put their boards together.

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And you're right.

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Just because the guy runs a fast 40,
that doesn't necessarily mean that all

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of a sudden he's going to make a great
prospect because John Ross, a couple

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of years ago, who ran the four, two,
who Xavier Worthy broke his record, I

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mean, whatever happened with him, he
got injured with Cincinnati bingos and

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his career just kind of went kibbutz.

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So it goes back to
going to the right team.

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You don't necessarily, I always put it
this way, let me back up for a second.

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Yep.

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It's not when you go, it's where
you go and can that offense or that

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defense set you up to be successful.

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So it's going to be really
important for coaches to now

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go back to the drawing board.

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Uh, reevaluate their draft board,
move some guys around, guys who

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they had at the top, they're gonna
probably move down to the bottom

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based on some of these performances.

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But the idea is, don't, don't
reach because there's a lot

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of talent that's out there.

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Alex Hardy: So, we'll take Marvin Harrison
out of the equation because he, he showed

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up, he did interviews, he measured in,
but no, no, no combine performance.

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And, uh, He's expected to be the
wide receiver one in this draft.

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Can you give me two or three guys
that you're very interested in where

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their potential outcomes could be?

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Nick Ferguson: Well, for me, you
mentioned Neighbors who, uh, he didn't

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participate, uh, in the combine as well.

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That's a guy who definitely, you
know, for me comes up because, uh,

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outside of Marvin Harrison Jr.,

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Neighbors is probably wide receiver two.

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Alex Hardy: Now could that or, or one
B if you wanna make that argument.

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Yeah.

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Nick Ferguson: And, and, and could
that have changed with, uh, Rome

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Dunay and, and how he performed?

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Abso freaking, absolutely.

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But

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Alex Hardy: was this, so for perspective,
for a dunay, is he vaulting himself into,

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are we, are we talking about three top
receivers as opposed to kind of separation

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from Harrison to Neighbors to a Dunay?

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How does you know his performance at 6
3, 2 12 running a 4, 4, 5 and having,

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you know, a insane jump and three cone.

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Where does, where does that
kind of factor in for you?

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Nick Ferguson: Well, I mean,
obviously that puts him at,

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you know, you can say 1A, 1B.

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Uh, and listen, there are a lot of
guys who perform well at the YBC

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position and they were benefactors
of neighbors and Marvin Harrison, Jr.

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Not performing because these guys were
considered, I'm not going to say third

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tier, second tier, but no one was really
talking about them as they were talking

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about neighbors and Marvin Harrison, Jr.

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But now.

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The conversation has now changed.

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Now, Neighbors and Marvin Harrison Jr.,
they have to have exceptional pro dates.

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Like a doomsday, a doomsday
can say, you know what, I'm

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not going to run the 40 again.

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I'll, I will run routes for you,
but that's about it because he has

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already encapsulated his ability
and left his mark at the compound.

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So there's not too much pressure on him.

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It's like, hey, either
you take it or leave it.

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The pressure is now is
on Marvin Harrison Jr.

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and Neighbors To really show
and validate their skills on the

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field with absolutely workouts.

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So it's going to be, once again,
it's going to be interesting.

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And every single year you hear this
phrase about there's a deep pool of wide

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receiver is not, it's not a deep pool.

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This pool is really deep because there
was a lot of receivers who ran fast

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times and really put themselves on a map.

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Alex Hardy: We'll be looking back at this
class in particular, not just because

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of the talent, but we have a lot of.

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5th and 6th year players
due to the COVID season.

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This will bear out in the next draft
as well, where we just have a, what

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seems to be a larger pool of talent
based on, um, you know, the, the

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issues in 2020 and 21 with the seasons
kind of being turned upside down.

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So, I'm excited to see how this bears
out, um, we talked about the wide

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receivers a little bit today, I'm
going to save the offensive linemen

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for a future episode because they
deserve their time to shine as well.

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You talk about Outstanding performers
and premium positions, but to wrap up

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our NFL combine conversation, at least
immediately after things wrap up, uh,

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we're going to, we're going to do Nick
before we split and Nick Ferguson,

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you were right here on those guys.

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This, this podcast right here,
talking about the criticism for

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Drake may not participating in the
throwing drills, just showing up

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interviewing and getting measured.

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And meanwhile, your guy, Jaden
Daniels, comes to Indy, doesn't

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00:19:10,658 --> 00:19:12,398
get measured, doesn't throw.

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And so Nick, before we split, do you
have that same energy for Jaden Daniels

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and even less participation in Indy
than you did for Drake May a week ago?

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Nick Ferguson: Well, look, the
way that I look at it is that

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it's always great to, to compete.

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The one thing that changes
it, it all depends on how

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NFL stars actually view you.

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For a guy like Drake May, there still
are some concerns about his ability

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and even though in certain my draft,
they some have him, you know, the

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second quarterback going off the board.

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So this was an opportunity, him,
opportunity for him with Jake Daniels

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00:19:47,858 --> 00:19:52,328
not throwing, or Caleb Williams not
throwing to really cement himself

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00:19:52,598 --> 00:19:57,098
and dispel all those rumors that are
out there from a negative standpoint.

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But also when you look at.

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You know, Drake May and Jade Daniels.

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Let's compare those two quarterbacks.

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One threw for, uh, more than 1, 000 yards
and rushed for more than 1, 000 yards.

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And one went from ASU Pac 12 to SEC.

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It really balls out and SEC is considered
by, by most as the top conference in

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00:20:19,628 --> 00:20:22,358
the NFL and just a tier below the NFL.

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So if Jade Daniels can do that
against superior competition, And

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you look at Drake May playing in the
ACC, which I'm quite familiar with.

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Sure.

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Based on the perceptions.

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So you got a little jacket.

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00:20:34,123 --> 00:20:34,513
Yes.

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You're going to look at, you know,
Jade Daniels and give him more value.

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And then also he won the
freaking Heisman, right?

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So, so with that guy, there's, there's
a little cachet that comes with it, but

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here's what I love about what Jade and
Daniel said, why he didn't participate.

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He wanted to go back to his pro day
and show some love to some of those

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other players who are prospects.

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For the NFL who are
not getting that shine.

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The light is not shining bright on them.

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So he's trying to flow some
power to his teammates.

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So I understand that.

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But this was an opportunity for
Drake May to silence all the critics.

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Now he can be measured against a Bo Nix.

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00:21:13,263 --> 00:21:15,363
Or, or, or a Michael Penix.

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00:21:15,613 --> 00:21:19,343
Both of those guys who were in
the Heisman Trophy conversation.

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Drake May wasn't.

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Drake May wasn't.

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00:21:22,463 --> 00:21:26,783
So you want to make sure that you put
your best foot forward against those guys.

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Is this truly going to hurt Drake May?

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00:21:29,703 --> 00:21:33,933
We'll have to wait and see, but for me,
I still would have wished that Drake

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May would have performed at the combine.

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Alex Hardy: He's Nick Ferguson,
former 10 year NFL safety.

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00:21:40,663 --> 00:21:44,063
I'm Alex Hardy, we are those
guys, we hope to be your guys,

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00:21:44,253 --> 00:21:47,463
and thank you for spending time
with us as we recap the Combine.

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00:21:47,673 --> 00:21:50,883
As the weeks continue ahead
of the NFL Draft, we'll go in

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00:21:50,883 --> 00:21:53,833
depth on certain players that
Nick has been grinding tape on.

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You can always follow him at
NickFerguson underscore 25 if you want

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00:21:58,463 --> 00:22:02,433
any questions about your team, uh,
especially if you are a Broncos fan,

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00:22:02,443 --> 00:22:07,428
he's trying to figure out who that next
quarterback will be, uh, in, in Denver.

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00:22:07,738 --> 00:22:09,718
Uh, you can also check out those guys.

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00:22:09,728 --> 00:22:15,678
We're doing a recap of the NFL, uh, uh,
the Patriots dynasty, the documentary

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00:22:15,678 --> 00:22:17,318
appearing on Apple TV every week.

397
00:22:17,328 --> 00:22:21,318
You can catch us after the episode
airs recapping what we're seeing

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00:22:21,478 --> 00:22:25,938
as Tom Brady ascends and declines
with the New England Patriots.

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So until next time, Nick, I'm Alex Hardy.

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We're those guys.

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00:22:31,548 --> 00:22:33,398
And what do you have to say
to the people, Nick Ferguson?

402
00:22:33,818 --> 00:22:35,358
Nick Ferguson: Put the money in the bag.

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00:22:36,933 --> 00:22:38,213
Alex Hardy: In the bag.

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00:22:38,523 --> 00:22:38,953
Alright, peace.