the which movie project all right howdy folks I am Just Blane Bob Briggs most of you don't know who I am right but hey we're having fun and this is the which movie project me and Courtney put this thing together about six months ago or so oh yeah started talking about this and it just happened I got roped in she got roped in it wasn't hard because we all we did was really talk about a bunch of which movies and she is day breaks local which so it was very easy for me to say hey would you like to watch some which movies and talk about them with me yes and that was her answer that was it that was all it was because we didn't have to ask much more now I gotta say though that this was a selfish project of mine because this for one is Joe Bob Briggs this is my ultimate homage to him best it gets sorry Joe Bob if you're watching but Joe Bob Briggs is a horror he started doing this a long time ago on TNT for monster vision he's been doing it longer than most of us in here have been alive actually yes longer than all of us have been alive I just had a look around the room but this is something that he's been doing is basically hosting movies so yes selfish project of mine and I brought her into it because I watch these movies anyway don't you like oh yeah I love movies so sign me up now out of the ones that we did though Courtney which one which one which was your favorite that's a hard one now that's really hard because I had favorites that I had picked when we made our lists we did like a master list right all of our favorite which movies and stuff some of them didn't even make it on the final roster but I had my favorites already picked out I was like practical magic you can't go wrong right who loves practical magic midnight margaritas so my favorites right I mean that's not too horrible not too horror scary like real tame real realistic as far as what I think which is really are like but then I had to watch a bunch of movies I was really uncomfortable with and then loved them oh yeah I watched them so now to pick a favorite would be like a favorite of which kind it's tough because we had we had here's the thing we had family movies in there and we had the scariest of scary now if I had my way let me go on a little rant here if I had my way you know what we have is shown tonight and I had to get talked out of this by everybody that there was but I wanted to show the autopsy of Jane Doe but now some people say dollars she's she's too naked yeah well nobody thinks about that because she's getting cut open nobody's thinking about there's a naked woman on the table I wanted to show that and I might still show it I'm the one with the remote here Courtney yeah sorry kids y'all gonna have to close your eyes and not watch yeah it's a little bit a little bit too off the cliff as far as the witch movies go and I thought let's reign it back in and let's pick one that is just creepy enough to be like wait what is going on here and also in the family-friendly movie genre now this movie has got ties to witches because it's got one of the most famous witches right the wicked witch now if you haven't seen return to Oz is what we're talking about here it says fantasy action and adventure they forgot to put horror on there because this movie is completely creepy in all kinds of ways now you got to think about this this is made in 1985 45 plus years after the Wizard of Oz so for a long time somebody get the door please so for a long time this had to record for longest years between sequels until another movie came out called Bambi 2 which none of you guys saw that either but you definitely haven't seen the return to Oz but you got to see this and me and Courtney started talking about we said why do they need to see this movie it's tied to witches but this is the sequel to the Wizard of Oz and soon we've got wicked coming out so we wanted to make sure that everybody was up to par on their Wizard of Oz knowledge a lot of people that when this came out they were like oh this is not it right because they're used to Judy Garland I mean everybody loves the Wizard of Oz came out in 1939 everybody loves that version right everybody loves it but it's not as close to the novels and a lot of fans of this movie love it because it's a little bit more close to what L. Frank Baum had made when he wrote the novels and it does combine quite a few of the books in the series into one movie so you kind of have to set aside your Judy Garland version yeah and you have to appreciate this for what it is all by itself right now here's the book here guys I got an original copy of this thing you see this this has got like library prints and stuff this is really really old but you can see right here this thing is already creeping me out now I'm gonna sit here we're gonna read this entire book now I'm just kidding guys I'm not gonna sit here and make you but what I'm gonna do is this movie is set in about 1899 so even though it's 40 plus years after the original movie it's only six months after Dorothy has went to Oz in movie time so you got to think they're here in the 1899 1900s let me go in to talk about the economy back then is that okay Courtney you think I go off on a rant here huh no I'm not gonna talk about that either but the movie returned to Oz for Roosevelt she had to be terrified out of her mind watch just being on set the whole time it's no reason no wonder that she is kind of quit acting and disappeared now this movie probably still scarred her this is probably the one out of all the ones that she did but you're right if you're expecting the Judy Garland Dorothy cheery happy this ain't it so you're allowed to leave now for my live audience and you're allowed to stop watching if you're looking at home but what do you think Courtney should we start it up all right and what we're gonna do so let's start the movie but what we're gonna do is we'll stop the movie down every once in a while and we'll talk for a couple more minutes but we're gonna let it run for a while now I'm telling you I hope nobody here has nightmares tonight you see a lot of crazy stuff in here I mean they're gonna go to electroshock therapy right out the any I don't know if we should have kids in here watching this but let's go see this thing Dorothy is crazy and let's start it up now people are you know I said we're gonna stop it that's what we're here for we're still taping a podcast also so so we're 40 minutes into this movie and let's just go through a list here because electroshock therapy is not the worst thing we've seen yet not the weirdest thing we've seen a talking chicken tick-tock what the hell is tick-tock yeah the original yeah let me throw this out there for you though because I do want to put this out gymnast Michael Sundan actually stood upside down with his legs bent and backwards and walked to make tick-tock oh wow now Courtney can you now Courtney's gonna demonstrate how he did that so it says stood upside down with his leg backward I'm just telling you now that this is just the tip of the iceberg of the weirdness now you saw the wheelers I think they took the place of the flying monkeys I'm not sure that the wheelers are way more disturbing than flying monkeys I didn't find any reference of wheelers in the in the book no no I think that's something they found out it's a they found a costume at the dump the scrapyard there because the wheels look like something off of a stroller or something I'm not sure but yeah it kind of looks fun I want to try it I'm sure you'd like hold the wheels in the front with your arms and you like wheel around it's kind of like rollerblading but with all four limbs I think it looks like fun I would try it only her only her now let me make a gang let me tell you this so so I'm gonna throw this fact out there too because Judy Garland was 16 years old when she made the Wizard of Oz now for Ruz is only 10 she's 10 years old this is her first major movie she beat out 10,000 plus people to get this role they said there was 600 people in Vancouver alone oh I believe it and they saw her and they said that yes this is it and I think they I think they nailed it I really do I think for Ruzza plays a great Dorothy here even though she's six years younger than our original Dorothy yeah yeah and I would like to point out and M was much younger than the original and M in the 30s film I mean I imagine she was somewhere in like her 50s or 60s in the original movie and then this one was more like my age so there are only two actors that were still alive from the original when this one came in one of them was the main flying monkey maybe he's the one that said you know what no more flying monkeys we're not doing that so offensive to me but let's get back let's get back to the movie but before we do I got to point out here too that the violence this movie I believe has the highest body count out of all the movies we pick and we had Blair Witch project we had the witch Suspiria maybe Suspiria beat it I don't know we had a lot of bodies in Suspiria yeah what are the movies that we had we had quite a few others but I believe that's this one has the highest body count you saw a tick-tock over there he whooped ass he just whooped ass that gymnast in there upside down but let's get back let's get back in finally got that house done there it is there's a lot to unpack here yeah well is it just me or is anyone else attracted to jack pumpkin head I think he's pretty cute I thought he was kind of cute but that is my husband over there so that maybe maybe his wife well he's playing jack tonight Jack Skellington but let's not get it twisted because Tim Burton definitely took inspiration for Jack Skellington from jack pumpkin head I mean it's obvious how could you not it's it's the same figure right yeah you can see it now there's a lot though to unpack I want to talk about the gump yeah okay what the hell is the gump now they put together this bed some palm fronds and a gump head now palm fronds that's really you know that's what the leaves are that's called yeah yeah now a gump is not real though but fronds are okay I think a gump is a made-up fictional character that they've made just for this because I don't think I've ever run across a gump yeah no you have some oh Amanda has okay okay that's close enough so she's gone before yeah so oh well coincidences all over the place so that scene with the gump in the flying thing that was one of Walter Murch's favorite parts to film now Walter Murch was the director of this film he now that was also the hardest part of the movie to film which makes sense for Walter Murch because he got fired from directing this movie about in the middle early on actually because he was taking so long to film until George Lucas and Steven Spielberg came to his rescue literally and said no no no no you you got to give this guy a shot to direct this movie so they put in a word for him he came and directed this thing and as of October 31st 2024 this is the only movie he has directed oh well so I don't know if it's scarred in that bad if the experience scarred in that bad or if he just said you know what that's as good as it gets kind of a perfectionist maybe maybe maybe just took too long because he needed all the details to be just perfect but he but he got it together I think and what they put out here is definitely it's a cult classic yeah oh and it's definitely coming back you can watch it in movie theaters now people bringing it back I saw the movies we saw a poster for the movies here in downtown Salt Lake so it is yeah what else do you got to say about this movie before we wrap this thing up? Well if you're wondering why it's a witch movie Princess Mambi is actually a witch and in the books in the second novel she is a witch Mambi she's like the wicked witch of the West clearly taking her heads off switching out heads I mean that's not something a princess would do am I right? It's witches things. Witches.

You do that. Yeah. You swap out heads at night. If I could swap out heads I would. If I could go younger head yep I'll take it I would do it yeah so in the second novel though they had it was a orphan boy named Tip is the protagonist of that film.

He's the one that makes Jack pumpkin head to scare the witch Mambi like Jack says in this movie so just interesting that they pulled together a lot of things from the different Oz books so if you're young you like reading I might recommend getting the original series of the Oz books and reading them and if you're older you enjoy older novels more mature oh the wicked series is really really good very mature but it kind of takes that whole legend of Ozma and the explanation of why animals talk and it takes another kind of political turn with it and it's really amazing it's a great series this is the last one of the series out of Oz I've read all of them wicked son of a witch lion among men and watch your mouth watch your language oh oh you say son of a witch they're over there those guys over there there's sons of witches sons of witches over there those sons of witches now you got final thoughts on this movie a lot of final thoughts but first of all who we did in the craft the craft I mean I think to tie it all together that's that's my takeaway is she did an amazing job she's just a little girl I was a little skeptical at first being like really she's Dorothy I don't know about this yeah I'll give it a shot watched it and I was like I love her she's so cute and she really does an amazing job the acting I think she does a great job she does she's she's she's wonderful she's amazing she's awesome I loved her in this movie thank you to the one time and only time director for making this movie yeah I gotta tell you though what the real horror is and this is my final thought and it's Disney's marketing department this film was about as well promoted as a county fair and a thunderstorm like really it was like that's what it was and you got to think it came out in the 80s you got neon colors and pastel and all that and then here comes this dark fantasy so they'd really didn't know what the hell to do with it and it's more Tim Burton than it was Walt Disney at a time when Tim Burton went around like he wasn't doing this this kind of stuff yet so I gotta say that that's yeah so on that the final note for me is this is a cult classic it is remembered because it dare to be different all you kids listen dare to be different at everything you do because you can't get any weirder than this okay thank you guys we didn't tell the people here that this is actually a double feature and we're gonna watch hereditary now that's A24 movie or red tears or did or did you have other plans for the hereditary movies well actually you're gonna have to meet me at a certain location oh man and will meet will yeah this one's gonna be on location I'm a little worried about that I'm gonna send you the address and I'll meet you there we gotta wear the same clothes or what we going straight there what's happening that's interesting all right now I'm a little worried about this so we're not gonna watch hereditary here with the kids and stuff yeah no this one is one I had to watch through my my fingers it's a great family movie though and it's all about family it is all about family that's hereditary yeah about family all right let's get out there where have you led me to maybe the cemetery I'm a little concerned this looks really familiar now as and you know what though as I was driving up today it was supposed to be warm sunny closer I got it got colder over here you got darker yep am I dark clouds rolled in right over us am I looking at this is where they filmed the funeral scene for hereditary is it not yeah yeah oh my gosh I got the cemetery over here on our other side are we sitting on bodies it's possible oh my god with all due respect now we don't want a name where this cemetery is but we do want to say thank you to them for being it's beautiful out here but yeah for no wonder that they like this location for filming because the mountains are awesome they are and I wondered when I was watching it because I had to know but the mountains and things that looked like Colorado and I kept thinking maybe they film this in Colorado but I think Ari Aster likes Utah Ari Aster really liked to Utah right here and there's yeah like you said he had to this movie we tried to find a through line for return to Oz and for hereditary and honestly we just picked these two movies because I mean it was what return to Oz was creepy we wanted to do it and then we had hereditary and she had never seen hereditary and novel daybreak recommended hereditary which I honestly we shouldn't say that because okay at novel recommended hereditary so he's like I love horror movies you guys are doing hereditary right and we're like well actually no we didn't have it on the list but we had to give it a second look right yes well let's figure out where this fits in and it may have felt like we threw these two movies at the very end like we wanted them on the list we wanted to do them but we weren't sure where they fit in so we threw them together but as we were watching return to Oz Saturday at our live event I was like there's a lot of headless stuff going on here yes so I think there is a through line I think you looked at me at one point you're like that's it and we both looked at each other because we we said you know what hereditary's got a lot of different kinds of headlessness that comes up now this movie if you haven't seen it it's feel good it's a laugh a minute right it's a great flick oh yeah oh yeah family smiling ear to ear when you're watching this movie am I right beautiful loving family lives in a beautiful mountain range I mean it's it's all fun and games tree house right but if if your idea of a good time revolved around heart palpitations and sweating then yes you'll enjoy this movie yeah but it's another A24 film and it is a miserable watch once again yeah which is a common theme in the A24 movies and hey I mean that in the best kind of way because the atmosphere everything from the beginning of this movie is we're sitting here it feels there's an atmosphere even sitting here I mean we are in a cemetery so which is where I find a lot of peace and comfort it is it is it is peaceful out here yeah not that part though not not you can already tell in the beginning of this movie that you know what did you have some more thoughts on return to Oz because well I will say so the headless yeah yeah yeah yeah I remember so we kind of showed at the event the the little golden books they had a return to Oz I used to have one when I was a kid and this may speak to my morbid fascination with things I don't know but I remember being obsessed with that book I remember looking at the pages so carefully the cabinets full of heads and then the part where they're screaming so they had an illustrated version of these heads and they're like mouths are open I remember staring at that I was probably five years old and I was just like what is happening here I had never seen the movie not then so I was like I don't know what this is but this is not the Wizard of Oz that I know yeah right and I'm looking at it real hard and I kept thinking am I allowed to look at this? Is this okay? I'm a kid but I was fascinated with the headless heads and the and the princess mambi chasing her with no head and she's they're all screaming Dorothy Gale Dorothy Gale it is scary a lot of adults there that night said yeah I could never watch this movie when I was a kid I mean even the kids there I mean they had their mouth soap I saw yours at one point over there pictures of my kids that is wild what was it the wheelers got them? Maybe it was the wheelers maybe just the whole dark kind of feel of the film maybe that had about it they were just a little they were fascinated and if you thought that was dark it's not as dark as this one now no maybe people who were like oh yeah I like horror movies and then I mentioned this one and they're like oh couldn't do that one this one now you know what this one it's got a weird backstory with the movie itself because at first it didn't have the horror elements and it was just gonna be a drama and I believe that Ari and whoever else involved threw me in wrote in the demon and stuff and you'll get more we'll get more yeah yeah into what's the pie mom but this is right from the beginning and you have we did a pumpkin walk and we saw a pumpkin with miniatures and me and Courtney both like oh no we're not getting close to that thing because the opening shot of this movie is like it's a miniature and it's tied into the movie big-time later but it's a miniature and you you have a long long slow zoom and then there's that cool transition yeah where it goes to real people walking in and you got you got the real stuff going on and very symbolic of like we're going into this other world this isn't reality exactly but kind of I don't know but it's so like the miniatures themselves throughout the movie they're so realistic so when it comes and zooms in and then it comes to life oh yes the room that we're in yeah a lot of symbol symbolism going on there is and you know what I'll tell you I'll tell you this right now we will not be able to get to all of it we will not be able to pull out every single symbol because every time I watch this movie I guarantee you I've seen this movie I've seen it 10 plus times my best friend back in back in back from Memphis Derek he loves this movie and he's the one that put me on it this the first time and he said COVID was a hell of a drug he watched this movie about 12 times during COVID but yeah it is it's an incredible watch it's a great watch but you do notice something different every single time you see yeah and it's almost like if you don't pay attention you won't be yeah does it make sense yeah if you watch this movie you know that's true my mom is the one who and she likes horror movies too she said she's all right with that but I was like this is probably of all the lineup we've had in this series this one I was probably the most freaked out this is the one during watching it I was the most freaked out but but I said something to my mom I'm like oh my gosh have you seen this and she's like oh yeah yeah I did see that one it's all right I didn't really get that scared and I was like well did you see this and did you see this and she goes oh I didn't notice any of that yeah see I'm like you weren't paying attention you got to watch it again it's very subtle there's so many subtle little things and it is it takes you off guard it's a boring watch if you don't pay attention I know it really is it's a boring watch and that means yeah you've got to really look at this movie from a different perspective when you're watching it and sure watch it for what it is the first and then when you start thinking about stuff you go back and be like oh my gosh they did this already did all that for a reason like it was all on purpose it's brilliant when we're the opening of the movie basically is when Tony Colette her mom in the movie has passed and yeah we'll get to Tony Colette but her mom in the movie has passed and they are in this cemetery right here where we sit mountain rink still a little weirded out but yeah they just kind of feel like it's just kind of a your good old average old lady dies and it is and then you get to the funeral here and there's even subtle references here because she even says so many new strange faces here yeah my mom would have been where did you all come from I didn't see any of you in the last several years and like you know kind of a vibe ever yeah like ever in your entire and my mom's the whole life so who are these people that were here first of all you got these unsettling it's an unsettling eulogy really like the whole thing is weird it's awkward I've been to funerals they're not fun they're weird and awkward already this one takes it to another level already yeah the people that there's certain faces that you see later in the movie so if you're not paying attention you'll see like oh these people that are at this funeral they kind of give the little girl a look yeah one guy and you see him later yeah yeah so you've got all this stuff already setting up in the beginning opening scene that appears to be a normal funeral it is not it's Annie is Tony Colette's character so Annie's mom is the one that passes away Charlie is the daughter and you already see that she's just a little quirky yeah that's yeah yeah probably born with some admiral and she talks about like they are sure to mention like she takes out a candy bar and they're like oh does that have peanuts in it she's got allergies yeah I mean there's things that's that's a really interesting thing that we'll talk about later when we talk about what may be going on with the daughter which is you know that she's born with some illnesses and some abnormalities that kind of hint at maybe there's a connection there it does and she gives off the vibe she's she's the actor played Charlie's amazing too because the role for that is tough and it's an incredible performance but she really does she she basically embodies nope I don't want nothing to do with that like it's a weird it's a weird feeling and you see more of that later on Millie Shapiro that's who plays Charlie did you know she had a did you know that the sound that is now etched in I horror horror iconic that yeah she let's you know perfect that she learned how to do that yeah it reminds me the grudge it does or like yeah I remember when the grudge came out this movie for some reason it kept bringing up grudge yeah vibes you know I can't exactly pinpoint why but that sound from the grudge that was everybody was here oh yeah oh yeah it would like freak us out that became that and I swear the night that we watched it the middle of the night while I was sleeping I swear I heard it I guarantee you other people I don't know how that happens but it's wild it's that sound effect it's I thought I just heard it man I can't I'm what are we doing in the cemetery that's what it'll be like right behind you in your ear yeah that's brilliant though I mean if you really want to get into some of these psyche and be like the psychological thrillers like this that are just they dig deep burrowed into your psycho subconscious so you know what let me go off on a rant here for just a minute because I want to back in my day but it's not that I'm not that old but there was a time for us where horror movies at least had the decency to show you who's gonna get sliced up and diced up at the beginning like you knew who it was but now we've got this psychological warfare that it'll stay with you long after instead of a 90 minute slash your film we know what's gonna happen we see we can watch the two-minute trailer yeah we see the whole movie two-minute trailer no no no no you gotta sit here and basically we're getting swindled out there yeah we're getting swindled out and we're getting brought in here like this is a family drama movie like I said and then the pants scared us because man yeah I couldn't have told from the trailer or from the poster of this movie Hereditary I would not be able to look at it and be like okay I know what's happening here I know you know who the killer is yeah what's gonna happen would So past the cemetery we're at the basically the next little bit of the movie and this is where the creepiness it amps up quite a bit yeah you got any making these tiny little doll houses she's getting I am absolutely fascinated by I went to like a miniatures museum in Chicago one time they had an exhibit with like a whole room full of miniature doll houses and stuff I was fascinated by things that are teeny tiny but look real that was like probably one of my favorite parts of the movie I was like oh this is amazing look at this she's an artist those things were incredible those little the miniatures they had on set were awesome honestly the scene later on where it all gets torn up I go oh I cringe I'm like no but that's that that's indicative of a mother artist you know you never have time to really like devote to the craft so I really felt for in that yeah but yeah attention to those scenes though because each one is like a little clue and it'll narrow in on that it'll show you something that's going on and you're like wait what does that have to do with anything and it gets darker and darker and basically these are little shrines that she's building towards her family dysfunction she's building these little things and she knows it in her head or maybe it's some other supernatural whatever's going on I thought maybe this was just her artistic expression a way of like processing grief processing what traumatic things she'd experienced in her life and I mean that's kind of brilliant which that's you are a connoisseur of those kind of things don't you know a lot of respect for that because I do in in integrated processing technique the healing work that I do I don't necessarily the way that it works it's not with art but I have partnered it with art so that people can paint out their feelings and emotions and grief and you know whatever heaviness that they've got going on so I had a lot of respect for that part of the movie oh yeah oh she's as morbid as it seems because I could see the husband when in certain parts when certain traumatic things have happened oh yeah and he's like what are you doing yeah what if our son sees this you know he lives through it and she's like she's doing it as if she has no problem with it at all like it's not traumatic to her I think that's kind of amazing even the one that really bothered me was the telephone pole the telephone pole yep she's just doing it she was painting the blood on the asphalt yeah and now and I was like so so don't forget about Peter the teenage son he's got his own issues and he's the one who goes to the party with Charlie yeah Charlie has a reaction because she eats nuts something with nuts in it the cake has walnuts in it and then yeah she goes into what is that called hyper something shock oh yeah you did an epipen basically you should have epipen and drive in no they didn't have an epipen with them I don't know I kept shouting that on the TV screen the whole time I'm like where's your epipen yeah you would think somebody had one or somebody at that party but then again we know that this is going to go off the rails anyway this is where we really go off the rails and if we haven't been creeped out already well we get a little gore it was pretty horrific that whole scene driving down the road swerving to not hit the tier I was like I don't think I breathed the entire time and then when he's sitting in the car and everybody's just frozen he knew it's like prolonged right like that scene just goes on forever and you're like no no no I just remember sitting on my couch just being like no he's going to look in the rear view mirror into the back seat and I was like no no no and he doesn't though I can't imagine the way that that's made and filmed that's more realistic this is realistic horror is what this is because it hits you right in the feels it does and you're like oh what would I do I know the trauma of living through that that poor boy I just kept thinking oh that poor kid and that's only the beginning of the trauma in this movie because yeah that's just where it begins it is really that is kind of where it begins because after that we start delving even deeper into just misery grief and we get to see the most the performance of Toni Collette from the beginning of this movie all the way how she goes she's incredible isn't she who won the Oscar that year oh I don't know exactly and Toni Collette should have and she didn't even get a nomination I believe today she's incredible did you ever see United States of Tara I did yeah her ability to switch personalities voice her entire facial expression everything is incredible and you see that in this movie a couple of times oh a lot of times where she just switches and she's different I was trying to dress like her I was like I'm going to dress for the movie today and then I realized well that's just kind of how I dress all the time actually yeah yeah the way that she's dressed as mom in this movie and Toni Collette I just gotta tell you that we're sitting right here in the cemetery and this is where all validity for the Oscars should be buried right here because she not even being nominated I don't care about no rules about the came out at this certain time of the year or this and that no no no no no she should be an honorary Oscar member winner for that performance for sure yeah go ahead that's my the grief that she's expressing I still feel it I mean just it's cellular level grief if I just pouring out of her body if I grieving for her daughter if I saw her on the street I would give Toni Collette like I would I would be like oh oh my gosh I am so sorry for what you did you lost your daughter yeah I'm so sorry Toni Collette our heart goes your mother and then your daughter yeah but pay attention to that sigil that it's on her necklace in the funeral scene of her mom a necklace possibly you know we assume was given to her by her mother yeah so that same sigil that same symbol is on the telephone pole and right let's get into this now let's get into the to the supernatural to the whatever is it cult what is it what's happening here I think we're meant to believe that this is a coven coven that her she discovers her mother was a part of and this woman that she meets in the grief counseling she goes and she talks about her mother's life and her brother committing suicide and she doesn't she does say you have to pay attention again she says in that scene he was trying to put people in him or something like that the quote she goes he committed suicide she put voices in him yeah she put voices in him or put it in him yeah you find out later what that really was and what was really going on or at least what a lot of theories are I mean I think that nothing is laid out quite so simple in this movie so you have to kind of assume yeah piece together the puzzles but basically that this coven I prefer to call it a cult okay because a coven to me is something lovingly pieced together yes love and light and I would I would rather keep it that way in my mind but this is definitely basically a demon summoning cult that her mother had been a part of and this woman that she meets in the movie and what they really are doing is they're trying to revive or to possess someone with the demon of Piamon okay who is a king of hell whoa he's one of Lucifer's most loyal demons okay of hell this is a real demon this is real well real well yeah well we've had other movies where they've made up yeah this is something that is the Blair Witch was made up yeah like this is actually in yeah real this is a little bit like I almost wish it was made up in the movie yeah because when you're like kind of playing around with symbols and you know you're putting it on the telephone pole and you're putting it in the movie I feel like you're asking for trouble oh yeah oh yeah that's just me but yeah so you see that symbol throughout the whole movie it's like etched into the attic where the body was found skipping around a little bit that's fine we don't have to go in order I want to talk about the movie just overall because yeah there's all these symbols add up to what's really going on so Pumaan is a he's a king of one of the kings of Solomon from the book of Solomon and in like the Greek version of the book talks about him there's a lot of like references of him some mention him with a woman's face and some of them don't mention him with a face at all but the pictures that we have of him he's riding a camel and he has three severed heads okay so it's interesting because I wonder you know is the sacrifice to Pumaan or something to do with summoning Pumaan have to do with three severed heads because by the end of the movie we have three wow severed heads right let's see that's what we have you here for that kind of insight it's very interesting and you see the triangle yes symbol the triangle quite a bit it's in the in the floor of the grandma's room and when the woman that she meets oh yeah has it in her altar space when you see it she's knocking on the outside and she doesn't get inside but you can see the inside of her apartment has the triangle that's a representative of like a conjuring so there's a lot of like little references those those words etched into the wall behind Charlie's bed oh yeah and she even makes that in the miniatures right yeah she's even like writing that tiny little so you have the word satiny which is basically a summoning word for necromancy like bringing back to life okay these are words that you also hear the woman shouting at Peter when he's at school and she's like doing that spell on him she's dispelling his spirit from his body to make way for Piamon to to use his body but it's believed a lot of people watching this movie said that Charlie the girl was actually Piamon yeah she was born with Piamon's spirit from this coven so the mom had grabbed hold of her got her claws in her as Annie says in that one scene so she's like my mom had got her claws in Charlie she didn't get my son because they were estranged at the time uh-huh and I think the grandma Annie's mother was trying to possess her son and that's why he committed suicide from trying to put voices in her head inside of him that's an amazing so this cult was actually you know just trying to get this demon they're all a cult of this demon Piamon and they're trying to get him uh a body yeah but he needs a male body a vessel he needs a vessel a vessel and to be male Charlie ended up being born a female so you see that scene in the miniatures where she's trying to feed the baby you see the mom like trying to breastfeed the baby yes she's like trying to she was trying to do all of the rituals and summoning spells and whatever you want to call it to uh to get the baby possessed with Piamon's spirit so he it was successful with Charlie Charlie was Piamon from birth and then when she died which was actually planned hence the sigil on the telephone pole yeah absolutely it was like made to happen so that the spirit would be free to then embody Peter so the whole thing was getting Peter ready for him to be possessed with this demon wow there you go look at this watch the movie first before you listen to all that yeah because because I just spoiled it off for you but yeah but that interesting right it's very interesting and you've got you mentioned uh the lady that she meets at the grocery store yes now this is when yes in this movie she's fantastic too she is this movie just keeps delving off into chaos like yeah further further further into the darkest holes you can go and she meets this lady and she says something about a seance basically and Tony Colette Annie she's like you can see your daughter again I saw my grandson she thought she met her just like grief counseling like this grief support group um when actually she wasn't part of that group at all she just like showed up and got her little claws into Annie and was like come on you can do this you can do this with me I know it sounds crazy but you can summon spirits and I went to the seance and it changed my life and um I will say just side note on that um I do believe in mediumship I do believe in ethical mediumship so anybody that's uh you know trying to um play upon your grief or you know using your grief for earning money or um you know just be real cautious and careful with people who claim to be a medium or who can do a seance and contact your loved ones first of all make sure it's consensual and that they're ethical about it and um that's all I have to say about that part of the movie no no this miss Cleo stuff remember miss Cleo she made a whole bunch of money and then came out as a fraud and then made a whole bunch more money yeah yeah yeah don't be there I mean there are certain mediums I think that and I don't even mind mediums charging for their services I just think that people need to be cautious about you know trust your instinct when you meet someone who's like I can contact your loved ones from beyond and you know 1995 one time payment yeah don't fall for that no no just you know you can feel it when it's like I feel good about this person or I feel kind of like ew ew yeah so this woman kind of preyed upon her because she did like you're grieving for your daughter you can talk to her again I promise I talked to my grandson he was there it was PM on the whole time wow and then we get the seance scene with Annie, Charlie the dad yeah she brings them all in I mean Peter Peter the son I guess Peter yeah they're freaking out yeah yeah this is in this scene it's fantastic it is and it's one of those once again it drags on it's like you're like oh my gosh a lot of like long pauses and silences where you're like what is happening what's gonna happen and it just builds the intensity they really Ari Aster really we're like a catch toy he's out there just doing this with us I know right that's what it is the entire movie we're getting beat up on knowing that he can go in for the kill at any minute but it just it's just relentless and that scene ends up kind of like it builds up and builds up and builds up and when Charlie's voice comes out of her mouth ooo that's wild that's when I'm talking Oscar-worthy because she changes from the mom from Annie into Charlie Charlie right there and her voice that comes out of her mouth oh it's crazy but then it kind of falls flat right yeah it doesn't really give you the yeah horror like thing you're waiting for because it kind of teaches you it does til later what happens later oh my gosh just when it really hits the fan like when the climax of the movie starts hitting all I want to say is don't be fooled by the action happening in the scene make sure you look around in the shadow yes pay attention to what's going on in the dark because there's so much going on that if you were just watching the action you'd be like this is so boring Peter is taking forever to get out of bed yep that scene right where he's like mom this is the entire end the entire climax the pinnacle here basically was a stage play yeah everything has got to be perfect or that doesn't happen the entire scene can't happen right yeah it had to have been almost well it definitely was it was definitely choreographed we'll call it yeah because everything had to line up it did it had to line up perfectly or else none of that can happen walk us through that scene well basically Annie now possessed with Piamon okay dad's dead oh yeah in a horrific blaze of fire that Annie was trying to avoid she was trying to say like you gotta do this I can't do it but she was willing to sacrifice her own life to destroy the journal to end this whole nightmare but when she threw it in the fire herself it wasn't her that lit on fire it was her husband yeah and he lights up he's gone and Peter's just waking up from his incident at school and he's like looking for her she's already there in the room and it's just there's all kinds of there's this whole chase happening he runs into the attic she's banging her head on the attic door that part freaked me out oh yeah I was like whoo that was when I started watching through my fingers by that point when she's trying to get into the attic and some people asked online they were like well how does she get into the attic because he closes the door but there's people in the attic there's people from the cult already waiting already in the attic and so when he turns around when he finds the body missing and he turns around she's already out there with them just intense it's scary it's it's so horror movies don't really scare too many people out there there's a lot of people who can really handle them and watch them and love them because they can see through it and they're like I get it this isn't that no not this one this is one that will stick with you it will scar you I'm warning it will scar you out there if you watch this movie yeah I think it's because it runs through a family yes and no one again like most of our movies a lot of our movies in this series we've said there's no happy ending you don't see them like make it out alive or you don't see Peter like you know in those old movies when it was like Peter's the lone survivor and someone's putting a blanket around him and he's getting put in an ambulance and everybody's like it's okay it's gonna be alright this is what you want to happen yeah it does not happen the good old days of horror movies they tied things up with neat bloody bow right basically the cult wins in this one yeah I mean this is they achieve what they set out to achieve which was to get Piamana body to inhabit and that's what happens and it leaves it kind of open like you're I mean we got we're sitting here interpreting the movie and this movie's been out for a while and people are still interpreting different parts of it and picking out little pieces and saying oh well wait a minute I mean you pulled out the three heads thing like that's amazing so the grandma yeah Charlie and Annie eventually yep the heads herself yep and I think they needed the three heads in order to conduct the ritual to get Piamana it had to be like okay their payment for conjuring him and having him come back in a body and then and so the movie ends and we're left at home still questioning our sanity even more than I know when we started right yeah yeah see we're sitting here now I'm like maybe I should watch the movie yeah I'm like what did we see I mean the movie's incredible yeah this is the only one that after the end all of us I watched all of them with my husband we watched them together and by the end of all of them even like Suspiria yeah which was real gory at the end there I turned the TV off and I was like all right time to go get ready for bed yeah I can go I can sleep comfortable at night yeah this was the only one that I was like Matt said oh I've already gotten ready for bed so I'm just gonna head up to bed and I was like you're gonna leave me alone turn the lights on keep the lights on I think you should just come with me and we'll go and I'll get ready for bed and you'll stand there next to me while I get ready for bed and then we'll go upstairs together in the dark together yes okay yes that's good right yeah yeah this movie it still bothers me now yeah it's what are your final thoughts what are you have any more points you gotta hear I know we could talk about it forever we could yeah I know but I do want to point out I still want to claim that this isn't technically a witch movie yes I would like to say that because I would like to say this group of people even though they're conducting rituals and spells the way that I like to view and portray a witch or a pagan or someone who maybe operates in a spirituality closer to mine this would be more like a cult than it would be a coven of witches so that would be my final thought is maybe take that part loosely and enjoy the movie for the entertainment that it is absolutely the miserable entertainment that it is right my final thought on this movie is Tony Colette damn it an Oscar get her one now yep that's it that's all I gotta say about it I'll present it to her myself you know what though this is yeah right we'll get we will make an Oscar we'll bring it to her and we'll get Tony Colette okay Tony reach out we got you girl we might as well wrap this whole thing up because this is the end this is the end of the project but maybe it's just the end of season one because I looked and I saw that they had 167 more witch movies on IMDb are you ready to go through some more? maybe not 167 but for sure let's work through that list we can get season two maybe it'll be something different maybe it'll be something different I mean this first season it was only gonna be a first it was a pipe dream and then it turned into real stuff and then we started watching movies and then we ended up with lots of fun with Robin Lively herself we had Ryan Bartley from her anime queen out there from different movies and stuff and then we're here this is our guest our final guest is but on location set like we took this thing and ran with it now it's been a blast I wanna hear what other people out there got to say and what they wanna see us do next because I'm thinking I don't know maybe we can do some gory movies you know the kinds I like where they have a mask on and they got a knife and you know who it is and that's it yeah and I will I will agree with you on the next time we do a live podcast event yes let's do adults only and we'll do one of the hardcore ones the autopsy of Jane Doe the terrifiers and stuff oh oh okay we'll do the autopsy of Jane Doe I owe you that but I feel like we need a good group of adults yes that are into that kind of thing that can really enjoy it with us I think that would be a blast I'm down we should screen it in a cemetery how about that yeah maybe in a morgue anybody out there know a morgue we can film the next live podcast taping in I'd love to do that that'd be fun yeah reach out reach out to us until the end that's us that's it